What is Imagination?

What is Imagination?

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neave.com/imagination/
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you tell me

everything it isnt, until it is

A gift from God.

I got your imagination right here
neave.com/imagination/

the body is a world, what you refer to is the nation of images

magi images to be exact

It's a spook. Your mind is just matter and resultant chemical reactions thereof. Their is no individual self, outside of your material form, and that which differentiates you from others are your unique sense experiences and combinations and permutations thereof. Creativity is the material representation of said chemical reactions in the brain, which are not entirely unique, as they derive from the senses. You are an organic robot with no free will except a will to live because you are alive to read this with your senses. You are an animal, not a snowflake.

I'm redpilled btw.

Underage b&

it's what you use when the wifi's out and you can't stream trap pornos on pornhub.

The Argument. As the true method of knowledge is experiment, the true faculty of knowing must be the faculty which experiences. This faculty I treat of.

Principle I. That the Poetic Genius is the true Man, and that the body or outward form of Man is derived from the Poetic Genius. Likewise that the forms of all things are derived from their Genius, which by the Ancients was call'd an Angel & Spirit & Demon.

Principle II. As all men are alike in outward form, so (and with the same infinite variety) all are alike in the Poetic Genius.

Principle III. No man can think, write or speak from his heart, but he must intend truth. Thus all sects of Philosophy are from the Poetic Genius adapted to the weaknesses of every individual.

Principle IV. As none by travelling over known lands can find out the unknown, so from already acquired knowledge Man could not acquire more; therefore an universal Poetic Genius exists.

Principle V. The Religions of all Nations are derived from each Nation's different reception of the Poetic Genius, which is every where call'd the Spirit of Prophecy.

Principle VI. The Jewish & Christian Testaments are an original derivation from the Poetic Genius. This is necessary from the confined nature of bodily sensation.

Principle VII. As all men are alike (tho' infinitely various), so all Religions, & as all similars, have one source. The true Man is the source, he being the Poetic Genius.

>not posting the conclusion and application
>posting the inferior version

I thought this was a stag beetle with long mandibles...

I'll actually give an answer because I'm a serious fuck who loves ruining people's fun.

Your subconscious processes data much faster than your conscious mind, and it collects a vast amount of data that you don't know about. Think of it like a spam folder just filling up with shit marketing emails.
When you think, you pull things from your subconscious into your conscious mind. Each thought is the construction of a thousand or so different impressions, convictions, and experiences from your subconscious. Then that conscious though stirs the very subconscious it came from, leading to another thought.

It's why if you only read twilight you'll end up writing twilight. That's the only thing inside your head.

not bad. but:

why call it subconscious if it is actually more important the the tiny screen of consciousness? and why call it a spam folder? id call consciousness the spam, cause what is actually important and what actually determines us is what lies outside consciousness.

and your phrasing is confusing: you still frame the thing from the point of view of a supposed agent. it is not 'you' who 'pulls' things from the subconscious, but the subconscious itself who throws things to the consciousness. this consciousness does not 'stir' anything, it just receives end product of the working of the mind. the activity of the subconscious determines and is not determined by consciousness.

btw, your description is accurate but your phrasing still uses old terminology. im curious, where did you get that from? science?

also, you didnt fucking answer op. where does imagination fit in there?

i place it as the basic energy that does the work of integration of all the diffuse mass contained in the mind as the fruit of all our experience, wherever it comes from. the building blocks with which it works are ideas, which are the result of the 'subconscious' perception.

>this consciousness does not 'stir' anything, it just receives end product of the working of the mind.

The consciousness moves its self through the world, chooses to look at this or that, do this or that, think of this or that, this is the stirring, and contributes to the subconscious, they work in tandem

>The consciousness moves its self through the world

yes and no. the consciousness moves itself through the world created by the mind, not through 'the world' itself. and as such, it can only stir what has been created for her by the non-conscious mind. so yeah, in a way its a tandem, but the non-conscious mind is working at a higher level which is inaccessible to consciousness.

Content playing itself.
You people talk too much.

Maaaan, if ya gots ta axe, youll neva know!

ha!

The more interesting question, to me, is what are mental objects?

How do we perceive certain qaulia with no physical stimulation?

well that is a complementary question, for imagination is the worker, and those 'mental objects' are the blocks.

...

A hierarchal density spectrum of holograms, screens, memory (however that is stored), electric pulses, molecular motions, photons, the mind is like a very advanced photoshop/paint/etcher sketch supplied its potentials in part by genetics and in part by user interaction

The esemplastic power.

Okay but this still leaves a lot unanswered. If it is the case that imagination is a product of subconscious thought (which I do think is accurate to a certain extent) why are some people more creative than others? What quality can you pin down that differentiates Joyce from a regular person? Or what about Shakespeare from Einstein? Where both had avid imaginations but for some reason applied them differently. Reducing the question so crudely doesn't address so much about the nature of the thing itself.

Why do you have subjective experience?

Literally the definition in textbooks, remembering past sense experience and past imagination. I've been playing movies in my head for my life's duration so I have experience.
just false, the subconscious is processing more data that's all
Not confirmed. In 'tandem' means that one's working with another, it's actually more like one rises out of the other and can affect the other but we don't know to what extent the conscious mind is actually just subconscious thought.
As close as anyone got. This is a matter of observable science not philosophy.
Literally just partial memories. You don't remember the full thing, you only scan certain aspects of it and your subconscious stores tons more memories than your conscious does.
He said 'what' nigga
Its not 'subconscious thought', it's just subconscious. Imagine everything you heard was actually recorded but you didn't play any of it, and you suddenly tripped some button and it played. That's subconscious. You can't possibly put your finger on it because it's constantly communicating information, not 'thoughts' as we think of in the conscious mind just information.
>why some people more creative
It's literally insecurity and mental faults that push them to constantly try things in situations where they don't work and they get rewarded for them. They usually have shame, a difficult childhood, and are psychologically 'gifted'(actual term) which always presents tons of challenges for early childhood development. Basically the gifted and above kids end up asking questions that they can't give a voice to yet, so they think they are better than authority figures so they grow up to challenge the status quo no matter what. This isn't debated, it's just psychology.
Creativity is a process more than anything else, the result of trial and error as well as a well developed mind that is constantly looking for patterns and exercising itself.
>but for some reason applied them differently
Personality, that's all. Not that myers-briggs shit, just what they liked. Different ways of thinking, different childhood attachments and professional lives. Tack this onto the whole gifted thing where they have the psychological barriers to overcome.
>the nature of the thing
There's a literal definition so why not use that? You don't need to enter philosophy here, because anything you're going to say after that is just a 'what if' and 'I think it's' answer which is useless.
subjective experience is a misnomer, it's just experience. Experience is actually objective, they already have mind reading machines and dream watching machines. It's memory which is a piece of shit that can't be trusted.

Alternative perception.

>subjective experience is a misnomer, it's just experience. Experience is actually objective, they already have mind reading machines and dream watching machines. It's memory which is a piece of shit that can't be trusted.

If you open your brain and observe what's inside it, you won't find an image of your brain, you won't find the sounds you're hearing, you won't find the pain you are experiencing, nor anything that explains why your neurons are tied to your specific sensations and experiences.
You won't find an explanation of why your consciousness is located in your specific brain instead of another completely different one.
You won't find an explanation of what happens to "you" if your brain was replaced or modified with other parts.

Observing the brain and the materialistic world is not enough to understand consciousness.

All that those mind-reading machines and dream-watching machines do is merely translate the actions of your neurons based on a human-made system about how neurons interact and relate to what is being experienced. They aren't *literally* reading your brain and finding experiences inside it.

I agree and I normally love Psychedelia in all forms of Art but...is this a variation of Infinite Jest?

So you think creativity/imagination is something which must be exercised to become 'stronger' (for lack of a better term)?
>You don't need to enter philosophy here, because anything you're going to say after that is just a 'what if' and 'I think it's' answer which is useless.
Not so! Philosophy aims to deduce what things are as themselves. To say that we'll always ask 'what if' no matter what is. Of course were going to reach the point of saying "i think its this", but its only through logical deductions that we get there. In fact your scientific certainty is no different than this "i think its this" than my philosophical certainty of the same case since all knowledge is inherently based upon belief. Of course my philosophical stance is based on opinion, all belief is. Not to detour this thread but you really need to understand this before you make such claims. I have a feeling you're going to say "but my belief is based upon empirical evidence" but its still belief.

bump

...

you can only reap the seeds
once the earth has made them glow
but you shall never try and peek
while the earth is still in toil

for thy presence in that field
will make all the seeds weep
and at harvest time it'll be
you the one who'll be in grief

Reworking old ideas to make something new

thats memory

imagination is a spook.

memory is a spook too.

ok whatever. go do your daily prayer on st max's altar.