Low standards of STEM education

academia.stackexchange.com/questions/87737/depressing-tutoring

Oh, mein Gott:

>Tutor (Master's student) who recently transferred to an unnamed European university bemoans the standard of the 1st year maths undergrads there, saying they struggle to solve simple matrix equations
>An American CC prof replies:

"most students entering U.S. community colleges do not have 8th grade algebra skills, nor even 6th grade arithmetic skills (e.g., fractions, proportions, negatives, estimations, times tables).

[...]

"I've had a good chunk of a college math lecturer career at this point and I've never taught anything as high level as matrices.

[...]

"Many also clearly have learning disabilities"

Thoughts?

No thoughts

No words

We are doomed

Maybe because not everyone is good at math and if they were they would most likely not go to a tutor for help.

most students entering community colleges aren't going into a STEM field so it's ok

In Europe attending the tutorials is generally compulsory, to hand in the homework

The American is a lecturer so I presume reaches everyone also.

Well then why are they wasting time studying math post-18 then?

>most students entering U.S. community colleges
>CC
what did he expect?

Maybe students not literally at a level of intellectual disability?

How can you possibly study math at a "college" level if you literally can't multiply integers?

>"I've had a good chunk of a college math lecturer career at this point and I've never taught anything as high level as matrices.
It depends on what he is teaching.
If that's an Algebra/Linear Algebra course, that doesn't make any sense.
>Maybe because not everyone is good at math and if they were they would most likely not go to a tutor for help.
Read the discussion referenced moron.

Well considering its a cc and what seems introductory math I don't see why he would expect anything different. The two teaching systems are different of course but again not all who are taking those introductory courses will be going into the stem field or have any interest in stem. Even if they are stem there is a good portion of students who are just weak at math because of their prior experiences with it. As much as I'd love to live in a society where everyone had a strong background in math is silly to think that true, even in my lab I have colluges who can bearly do basic statistics. I don't know why you would except as a tutor to receive students who aren't struggling at math at probably the most basic levels. That's like expecting a child to know how to swim perfectly when they come in for swim lessons.

Its sad that so many poorly understand math but all you could do it's improve the teaching of it at the most basic levels.

You seem confused. Community colleges are for the mentally disabled.

>going to a school that charges you 50k a semester for a year of pass/fail courses
>not being mentally disabled
choose one

...

i myself have fallen for the stem meme. I at least go to a top 5 engineering school so i may skate by with a career before the bubble bursts like the lawyer bubble of the 2000s.

nothing makes me kek harder than a community college student studying stem. I mean a community college student studying anything is kekworthy but at least the english majors dont expect to get a 70k entry level job.

community colleges as well as any humpty dumpty public colleges might as well be scams. They prey on young people by offering a promise of a successful future, while actually making them waste years of their life becoming indebted.

whilst the influx of extraordinary amounts of money into the american universities has yielded the best schools in the world, most of them rely on false promises of prosperity

Lel

Just take solace in that you'll be on top of the trash pile that is the future.

If you are consumed by a mindless mob at some point of course.

>"I co ming offise to day AAAAaaaa?"

Gold

fuck off. i went to community college, transfered to a top 50 uni and made 80k out of school.

don't knock CC.

no, you didn't.

also lol at top 50.

>students asking actual questions on stack exchange get downvoted and instalocked
>complaining about students being dumb is popular and upvoted

what is that so hard to believe? I'm not the guy you replied to, but I know several people who have done the same thing.

Nothing wrong with that. When you see some high school tier question you almost know what happened.

Some fucking faggot kid found out math forums and thought they hit a gold mine of free math assist for the rest of their life and now just ask the most retarded shit.

And remember, all that basic crap COULD BE EASILY GOOGLED. Those people are a mistake. Why do they think that other people's time is worth so fucking little? I wish that instead of finding math forums those people would just find wolfram alpha and ask a computer question. At least the computer can't tell you are a fucking retard, no matter how many times you ask him to find a trivial derivative.

Retard students deserve to bashed in any way possible.

I know far too many people in my class who got jobs paying 70k+ with their EE/CE/CS bachelor's degree. even a guy with ~2.9 gpa got 72k starting offer from a major company

And I dont even go to a top 50 engineering program, mine is like rank 62 or so, it's a totally average state school that also has a guaranteed admission agreement from the community college system for those who get an associates.

this may be unique to electrical engineering / computer science but as far as i can tell you are full of shit. from my perspective stem is most certainly NOT a meme

replace all that with "law" and you sound like a pre bubble law student in 2004.

im not saying its currently a meme, but at my top engineering school, each graduating class is like 6 times as large as it was 10 years ago. This recent push into stem is not sustainable.


hopefully we are on the front of the bubble, I just need it to last a few more years in order to get established

if the bubble bursts when youre in school or just coming out, say goodbye to a career

there is a lack of existing tertiary options for people who aren't very smart

Confused. The guy goes to Europe and says they are dumb, but then an American says Americans are dumb? so both are dumb? great.

I am in Europe and it seems any non-STEM field is full of lazy assholes. my linguistics professor is pissing me off, he hasn't graded the exams from 3 months ago yet.

you do know that CC students can easily transfer to Berkeley or LA if you have a 3.8+, right

you do know that high school students can easily be admitted to Berkeley or LA if you have a 3.8+, right

>Berkeley from High School with anything less than a 3.95 unweighted
Lmao

I got to goof off in high school and not even take the SAT, and went through a year of piss easy CC for free and spent the down time doing REUs, now I've got a year left in EECS at Berkeley

just kek at people who actually took GEs at their 4 year

Where in Europe do you think he's from? His use of phrases like "we are two" makes me think Spain, since Spaniards are the only people I've ever heard speak like that.

>brags about being lazy
>engineering major
Checks out

The bubble won't pop if we stop pushing women into STEM. Most aren't made for it.

most of the people getting STEM degree's aren't getting STEM jobs. they are moving money around in excel or doing "project management".

women attrition out of industry at an incredible rate. after a year or so of sitting in a cubicle by yourself staring at a computer screen, they quit and go do something more socially oriented.

A lot of men aren't made for STEM either. There's no problem as long as the university standards are high enough, and they don't dumb down the material to make more people pass.
That's the problem with American for-profit universities as opposed to government funded universities: a for-profit university wants to have as many students as possible to get a ton of money.
The government funded university wants to admit as many students as possible at first, so they get that sweet government money, but then retain a high standard in education that sifts out bad students. Because who cares, they already got the money.

All good points.

being lazy is part of the engineering job description. maximum efficiency, minimal effort. i only work hard enough to justify the amount you pay me. anything more and i'm getting taken advantage of.

your intellectual prowess is your product. why would you give away free product?

I went to a community college and I can guarantee that I have been much more successful than a whiny little faggot like you.

pic related