He's right you know

i don't get the Mars fixation. Build on the Moon, prove it can be done, prove there is a reason to be up there doing stuff. And, the money will follow.

When people say go to Mars just because, it just shows you have some weird Mars fetish. good luck coming up with money for that.

ok so we get to mars then

Where do we get water? Groceries? Fresh fruits and vegetables? Entertainment? Fresh air?

Where do we throw away our trash? What about piss and feces? What about hospitals? Vitamin D from the sun?

He's already got the money, and the contracts. At this point it's just a matter of the engineering and design.

We send supplies in waves, before people even get there.

>water
Easy. We bring enough from earth, then recycle and filter our piss. We'll be in domes initially so if it evaporates it will get collected and reused.

>fresh fruits and vegetables
We'll bring the seeds for it and cultivate it in gardens and greenhouses in the domes. Easy.

>Entertainment
What is solar power? That's how everything will be powered, and rechargeable batteries.

Oops, pressed send on accident.

>Entertainment
That's how people will charge their tablets and whatever else. Besides, if you're bored, just jerk off or have sex. That's what they did in the old days.

>Fresh Air
We'll bring it and we'll be in domes initially while the planet is terraforming. The plants we bring will eat the carbon dioxide and give back oxygen. Everything will be controlled inside the domes initially.

>Where do we throw away our trash?
Outside, silly. Where else?

>Piss
Save it, filter it, reuse the water.

>Feces
Throw it out, burn it, who cares?

>Hospitals
They're called mobile hospitals. Just like the military uses. You can bring everything you need with you, and just get some qualified doctors to be part of the colonization crew.

>Vitamin D
They have pills that supplement that stuff. Obviously they'll bring it and more will come on resupply missions.

Bump itty bump bump

Yes he's right, now please fuck my wife with your negrocock

Build colonies on tilted rings on maglev tracks. Problem solved.

twitter.com/robert_zubrin

>ZUBRIN IS AN ANTI-TRUMP SJW FAGGOT LIBERAL

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

No wonder all his shit has been so fucking stupid
Buncha clown larpers

What a nutcase

>IBS
>colonist
pottery

I think the idea is that the Moon depends on Earth for its orbit, and if some catastrophe happens to Earth, the moon is screwed too in many cases. Of course, this isn't the case with Mars. Diversify our habitats and we'll have more chances of continuing our species even in the event of an extinction event.

Iirc it would take something like a year to get to Mars using our current rocket tech? We'd need some serious planning ahead and resource management to make a Mars colony work.

I'd say that we'd need to leave colonists on Mars for a year or two at a time at first, since it'd be incredibly difficult to find someone willing to sever all ties with family and friends at home forever but also be well trained an self disciplined enough to be considered for starting the "new world" as it were. Slotting aside 4 years (2 for traveling there and back) seems much more feasible in the early years. Plus I'm sure scientists would want to study the effects of Martian gravity back home, too.

Just a brainlet spitballing here.

>it's real

kek, what a retard.

Elon will never get us to Mars he just wants all our government's money

Mars has a fair bit of water ice
could melt that and use it, recycle it for more efficiency

You mean our money, since that's where the gov gets it from.

I mean, if my money is going to be stolen from me and given to cronies, I'd rather it go to making reusable rockets than wasting it with garbage like Solyndra, but it's still wrong.

>moon depends on earth for it's orbit
there's not a fucking thing we could do that would fuck that one up
to do so would involve literally blowing up the earth, and we do not have nearly enough weapons, or are even close to the weapons needed to do it

You spammed this very same post about reusable rockets, yet he proved your ass wrong
he's yet to give up on a project, so declaring he will is in direct conflict with all evidence, and speaks like you're some ass blasted luddite

We might not, but other shit in space probably could.

It would take another planet sized body smacking into the earth to do that
there is no asteroid that could ever do such a thing
asteroids that could cleanse the planet of life, Many, destroy the planet outright, No

>> Titan
Fuck no.

If you destroy the moon by mining and all that you'll destroy earth. If you destroy Mars meh

>Titan is next.
Yeah, ballooning in Venus' atmosphere 40 mio km away at Earth-like temperature, Earth-like pressure and Earth-like radiation levels with plentiful solar energy is too hard, let's go 630 mio km to a 100 Kelvin frozen hell of liquid methane lakes instead, grand idea.

what's the probability that our microorganisms adapt and mutate when we get to Mars to cause hyper aggressive viruses to arise and then subsequently taint any future colonization with life threatening illnesses?

Holy shit are you serious right now

Like wtf i just checked there's not even walmart there.

How u gonna buy stuff there lol?

>Mars has 1/3 gravity, which means all you need to do to counter the effects is strap some weight on your body and work out.
We actually don't know what living in 1/3 gravity does to the human body.

It seems intuitively obvious that it will be much better than living in zero g, but there's no experimental evidence. We've just been dicking around randomly in space, wasting time on keeping people in zero g for longer when we already know it's unacceptably bad for us, rather than doing important work on artificial gravity and the health effects of fractional g.

We know that doing exercise helps in zero g, but we also know it's not a total fix. Fractional gravity may pose similar problems.

Venus has zero hydrogen.

>We'll be in domes initially
No, you won't. Domes are absolutely retarded on planets without a thick atmosphere not only because of solar radiation but also because of space debris, and the only other solid bodies with a thick atmosphere are either scorchingly hot or bitterly cold. On most solar bodies you'd be forced to live mostly in underground tunnels, in most cases including the agriculture which will be insufficiently and inefficiently lighted otherwise (artificial lighting being able to control exactly the amount and color of light and to provide it 24/7 for quicker growth). That is if the human body can survive in low gravity long term without serious damage in the first place.

>Outside, silly. Where else?
>Throw it out, burn it, who cares?
Ah yes, ruined the environment in Murrika, time to leave and ruin the rest of the solar system. Not to mention dying if you arrive with a limited amount of resources and don't integrate them into a cycle.

It's not going to be as easy to harvest as melting some million years old ice, but factually you're incorrect.

It's so sad Mars is small. Imagine a planet with 1.5 or even 2g, that would be an awesome planet fitness lmao

Venus has plenty of hydrogen. There's about ten trillion tons of it in the atmosphere as water vapor, which would be comparably difficult to extract as CO2 in Earth's atmosphere. It's also in the sulfuric acid clouds, though I think this amount is less and doubt it's better to extract hydrogen here.

Carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, and hydrogen are all abundant. Some means of mining the surface would be necessary to get the full range of necessary elements.

God, all of these weirdos obsessed with playing with their own shit.

The Martian soil is rich in elements necessary for life, like Earth soil. There's no scarcity of the things you can recover from shit, and won't be for thousands of years of habitation.

Furthermore, Mars is cold. No matter where you dump sewage, it will simply freeze. It seems in good taste to bury it, so it won't dry up and blow around and you don't have to look at it laying around on the ground, but nothing more elaborate is necessary.

getting to mars is not all that matters.

Yes, it is. As a species we'll inevitably have to evolve beyond digging shit over until it's empty and then leaving our trash behind.

There is actually evidence that bone density regeneration requires to reach a certain mechanical stress threshold before it even activates, so living on Mars may be no better than living in zero g.

Problems with radiation or recycling can be solved but there is no way to get around low gravity issues in the long term, humans need 1g.

Future colonies will most likely be on rotating space stations, with planets such as Mars serving only as mining sites, but not a place where people actually live.

Is it that bad that he just wants to go to mars. Do you need some grand justification for everything you do?

>so living on Mars may be no better than living in zero g
You can wear weighted clothes to get the same stresses on Mars. You can't do that trick in zero G.

What about banked rotating rings? Fully aware that they would require silly amounts of mechanical engineering outside of zero gravity environments, but could they theoretically create a resulting force equal to Earth gravity in a partical gravity environment?

Moon has no hydrogen and carbon. There may be some in polar ice but it is not known how much. Mars has all the needed elements for colonization. I do agree that Moon is better as the first step, tough. We need fast iteration to perfect space colonization technology. Cant do that when launch window is only every two years.

I don't think some cargo pants and jackets with weights in the pocket will suffice. The force would have to be spread across the body exactly as evenly as on Earth, including your fingertips.

JELLO BABIES

>yfw the temperature lows in the warmest regions of Mars are warmer than the coldest regions on Earth

rotating space stations also enable human expansion basically without limitations

want more land? build more land

while Elon is aiming for Mars, this is the endgame of Bezos (Amazon, Blue Origin)

space.com/37572-jeff-bezos-trillion-people-solar-system.html

>yfw the Martian ice reserves are basically in the opposite places of those regions

Wear chain-mail.
>inb4 it's bulky
It's really not. It's nearly as flexible as cloth.

Your fingertips don't need it. Nor your arms. You can get the stresses there via just lifting weights.

>2058
>Earth is in complete ruin
>food and drinking water scarcity, burning temperatures, major cities flooded, hundred millions displaced, old epidemics resurfaced, walls go up all around the places saving the few from the masses
>everybody knows the jig is up
>Elun Musk and 50 millionaires that could pay for the trip + 100 technicians that can actually work this thing leave Earth to colonize Mars
>30 years go by since landed on Mars
>the process of colonization is doing fine but we haven't changed the basic socio-economic structures that determines our every interaction
>a small elite is emerging from the profits they receive by not paying us our full work's worth
>we might have left Earth, but brought with us what killed it: capitalism
I guess I should go back to work now, cuz Musk's men are watching.

>Titan is next.
europa m8

>want more land? build more land
From what, you clown, other than flying soil into space from Earth at five grand a kilo?

>socialism ruins something
>blame capitalism
Every fucking time. There aren't enough helicopters for you another method has to be devised.

assteroids

>we are living under socialism
And I'm writing from Mars.

what?!

with 0.3g you can build massive structures! Imagine a sky scraper 3 times taller than anything on earth. At 0.3g giant gundam robots become feasible. You could safely run them on nuclear power cause there's nobody around too.

What we REALLY need for life on mars is energy and the ability to adapt to changing or unknown situation. I won't say it's the best idea, but living inside a giant gundum robot gives it an extreme amount of adaptability, and making it thorium powered means refueling from earth can be done with a tiny 1m3 cube craft at sent at high speeds.
Getting there may take months, but assuming they can make all the materials they need (with sufficient power supply) then the only thing they'd need from earth is thorium which could be shipped in a few short weeks at high speed.

Tell me how that goes.

Are you denying that capital has the most power in the world?

>flying soil into space from Earth at five grand a kilo
First of all, that price only stayed around because the market was for a few satellite launches per year. The unavoidable energy costs are more like $10/kg, and that assumes that the cost of energy doesn't go down.

Secondly, Earth isn't the only place to get material. The moon is airless and low-g, making it suitable for simple, efficient linear motor launchers powered by nuclear reactors or solar collectors. Even on Mars, the reduced gravity and lower air pressure means only one stage is needed with mass fractions under 70% propellant.

all the chemical elements are available in asteroids and there is no need to get them from the bottom of a deep gravity well such as Earth

>Entertainment?
fat lazy american zombie detected

>Birds in the exclusion zone around Chernobyl are adapting to -- and may even be benefiting from -- long-term exposure to radiation
>Laboratory experiments have shown that humans and other animals can adapt to radiation, and that prolonged exposure to low doses of radiation increases organisms' resistance to larger, subsequent doses.
sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/04/140424223057.htm
Exactly how much ionizing radiation is there on the surface of mars?

Clearly life is more than capable of adapting to ionizing radiation, we simply haven't done so because life's never needed to before. Is the radiation levels on Mars low enough that life in general can adapt to it? And if humans could adapt, how many generations would it take to happen naturally? And is there a way to speed that up or provide pharmacological equivalent to natural ionizing radiation immunity? What are the limits to natural radiation immunity? Could astronauts be acclimated very slowly to it so they can travel to Mars in an unshielded craft?

>create giant glass dome on mars unshielded from radiation
>life adapts to radiation
>farm radiation immune plant/animals
>extract immune properties and process into drug
>ship radiation drugs back to post-WW3 nuclear holocaust Earth

I meant call me back to tell me about how catching astroids worked out for you.

>Exactly how much ionizing radiation is there on the surface of mars?
Enough to significantly increase cancer rates among humans. Not enough that you have to worry about radiation-shielding crops and livestock.

>On 26 April 2012, scientists reported that lichen survived and showed remarkable results on the adaptation capacity of photosynthetic activity within the simulation time of 34 days under Martian conditions in the Mars Simulation Laboratory (MSL) maintained by the German Aerospace Center (DLR).[19][20]

Why is colonizing other planets so important to everyone. Does it scare you that we might go in a different path than your niche shitty comics said we would? Do you fags also want flying cars?

Look at Earth and what humans have done to it. We've changed the climate, destroyed habitats, and now with nukes and our retarded leaders, we risk destroying it all over some silly politician's wars.

We need to get away and start over. We need to expand and continue in other places. If we don't eventually, sooner rather than later we're going to goo extinct if we stay on earth.

Nah man. Giving people an escape plan nullifies the mutually assured destruction which has kept a nuclear Holocaust at bay. I'm all for responsibly exploring new worlds but right now the human race isn't mature enough.

Flying cars are absolutely retarded, don't be silly. The airspace already requires meticulous monitoring for a fraction of the traffic that roads receive, and defects will cost you your life, not just leave you stranded on the shoulder.

>>Do you fags also want flying cars?

>implying they don't exist

>Literally being retarded
Humans can't even get Earth right. They can't survive on Mars. What're they gonna do, send all the rich cunts to mars to die of microgravity and start eating each other once they realize robots aren't going to do all the manual labor for them? Not to mention the fact that humans have NEVER ONCE created a self-sustaining habitat that actually works. All attempts have been monumental failures, so it'd be fascinating to hear how they're going to, ya know, fucking breathe.

>Too inept to build a functional civilization in a garden with all resources available
>Now let's do it on hard mode with no resources!
Fucking. Stupid.

Elon Musk is just a welfare whore.

If you can't play Earth on easy mode, you sure as fuck can't succeed on Mars on hard mode.

...

I just don't get why a STEMfag would want to defend capitalism. It's a completely defective and wasteful system that is prone to crises every 15 years.

Real capitalism just haven't been tried yet. Neither the USA nor the globalized market are truly capitalist systems, they're always held back by selfish regulation.

>The airspace already requires meticulous monitoring for a fraction of the traffic that roads receive
Thats a weird government thing though, not some practical reality

I was watching some video clip and a pilot sees another plane miles away, then he goes "Well time to get out of here, airspace is getting crowded"

Absolutely delusional

why not just lift w8s

Right now, we theoretically have 1 billion years left before it gets to hot for life on earth. So unless we want to go extinct, we will have to do this anyways.

>we have 1 billion years left
kek, more like 100 years. Heard about ocean acidification?

reaching them is easier than getting to the moon, energy wise
the landing part is done by computers, so that one is easy too
and everything that cannot be automated is done by well trained and very experienced people who know what they're doing, so it'll be smooth sailing as well on that one

retards pretend that it's some unholy complex thing to land on a space rock larger than a football field when things like aircraft-to-aircraft fueling are similar, yet a lot fucking trickier, and is extremely common despite that

>samefagging this fucking hard
go back to leftypol and stop fucking up my space threads, you scat eating furshit loving degenerates

>go into space while we still have capitalism
>(Star Trek scenario already ruled out)
>meet first intelligent lifeform
>they naturally don't have barbaric notions such as private property or profit
>they look at us like you'd look at a disease
>Well, I guess we humans are left with no other options but to spread some democracy to them aliens!

What's the fucking point, even?

>retards pretend that it's some unholy complex thing to land on a space rock
No, I just think it's an utterly excessive effort of time and material just to dig up a small pile of dirt, ore or minerals. I mean, you can't realistically stop a cubic kilometer worth of material going 25 km/s, so your only choice is to hop onto it, pickaxe a few buckets of crap out of it and fly off again unless you want to end up on the other side of the solar system.

5-8 years

That's more than one person, retard.

I think you're being retarded on purpose

You don't need to stop the asteroid, if anything it would be in your best interests to not do so
You do not need to bring completely new equipment every time you want a bit of ore, it is left there and continuously extracts minerals for use
and there's thousands upon thousands of asteroids that do not fling off into the void, but instead stay quite close to the earth's orbit, where extraction would be very easy to do
asterank.com/
this wonderful website catalogs quite a few asteroids, and shows estimates of their value and potential profit based on that value as a bonus

There's a lot more to this sort of thing than you think, and the problems you believe exist aren't really there

Strapping on weights will only effect the muscles and bones. The movement of fluid in our bodies can't be adjusted by just simply strapping on weights.

Elon Musk is a hack, but he is right about Mars. We should first work on mining the moon. Set up mass drivers on Earth (maybe in Nebraska) to cheapen space travel. World's first trillionaires start popping up.

You fucking memed retard.

Life extension is the only thing that matters, especially for young people who got an actual chance of it working.

Now repeat it till you got it.

Movement of fluid in the body isnt a concern on the ISS, why would it be a concern on mars?

>Alt Right international

Asteroid mining >>> Landing on a meme wasteland planet

friendly reminder elon musk founded paypal the WORST COMPANY EVER