Why does it take amazing flawless grades to go into med school and many years just to be a "family doctor" or a "legs specialist"??
Why do biomedical scientists or pathologists have less to study than doctors? Do doctors really need all these years and grades?
Is their study domain really that complex?
In practice, the vast majority of shit you learn and study is useless in the actual workplace.
So no. But society has deemed healthcare to be too important and skill-intensive a field, so people demand only the most qualified people to treat them.
I mean would you want a guy that failed all his tests to treat you for your cataracts or whatever?
>failed all his tests to treat you for your cataracts or whatever?
Fuck yea if it means I don't have to wait for a year for treatment.
Also, I wouldn't want a firefighter to burn my house or a policeman to kill my cute corgi
This, why would you want to be treated by a brainlet that can kill you.
Because my doctor blatantly uses WebMD to find the best course of action and medical malpractice is a leading cause of death.
Because the AMA has a government granted monopoly which allows them to restrict supply so they can line their pockets with more cash.
Next question, please.
Maybe in America
Land of the free, baby.
>it's the all powerful jew illuminaty big gov
next argument.
This is literally the reason, the AMA decides how many residents and medical students can be trained a year. Every other reason stated is bullshit.
people tell me it's because medical supplies in universities are limited and expensive, and the studies are hard so they can't accept every student.
Training a biomedical scientist is probably more expensive, yet grad schools are not as competitive.
Being this shilled.
forbes.com
Do a little research before commenting next time.
Probably because the association running the medschools is run by doctors and they want to prevent their field from becoming saturated. Hence enrolment is limited and therefore competitive. Also, the only way you can justify the huge tuition is by guaranteeing a high paying job afterwards, which you can only do if you control enrolment.
This type of cronyism undoubtedly costs lives.
The whole thing is fucked. What's most fucked about it, in my opinion, is that most people that actually DO make it through cheesed it, and are in reality brainlets.
Don't get me wrong, I respect people who want to become doctors because they want to help others, or they want to work their ass off to get there, but going to one of the most competitive schools in the world for pre-med and med, my eyes have been fucking opened. Most of them don't even get top grades by studying, and almost none of them study in any way that promotes critical thought, only rote memorization. Cheating and abusing drugs is widespread and normative, and this problem continues into grad school.
It's a cancerous cycle of arbitrary bars set that only serve to restrict flow into the industry like says. For some positions in the medical field, it's okay to be a brainlet and not have to do critical thinking, but rather be skilled in data collection- that's something that every lab, research group, or hospital needs. But it doesn't make good fucking doctors who have to make complex judgment calls based on analyzing data on an extremely case by case basis.
well. I guess I have been redpilled. If only society wouldn't see doctors as better than every other field...
Instead of worrying about a false positive, in other words detecting cancer when there is none, medical doctors have to worry about incorrectly determining the cause of an illness or not finding the problem fast enough. If you prescribe the wrong treatment from the data you get observing a patient's symptoms then you seriously risk them getting worse from your bad diagnosis or there might simply not be enough time to test a treatment, observe the outcome, and then follow up with a new course if your previous one failed.
They don't have a lot of room for error. Especially as you get into the more deadly and rare types of illnesses medical doctors need to be both familiar with those diseases and have the clinical knowledge to be able to handle complex scenarios. An example would be someone who has diabetes but also has an autoimmune disorder.
I think society sucking off doctors isn't necessarily bad, because it is a necessary profession for the smooth operation of society at large, but it's disproportionately idolized, and it is a problem that society sees doctors as inherently smart.
I don't know about blaming the jews, but it is a state sanctioned monopoly...the shortage of physicians in this country is an artificially created one.
Speaking as someone who is working a trade that works with physicians and went to college on the side for an unrelated major, I took some of the same classes physicians did, and physicians are not as academically special as they or the rest of society think they are.
Many medical schools turn down stellar students with excellent GPA's who would excel in both medical school and a medical career; Ironically I have known failed pre-meds who would make better doctors than some of the successful ones I knew.
Admissions are unnecessarily competitive, and the environment it creates in the pre-med classes I found myself in for my major was toxic. I notice this same toxicity in the medical field as well, and I swear to God, I can't wait to be done with working in hospitals. I also dread going to the hospital after taking these classes.
The supplies are expensive because the companies that make them try to make as much stuff as possible that is "single use only" and goes in the trash; a lot of the supplies that are thrown away at the end of a procedure could be replaced with reusable items.
For example, There is one kit for a procedure that comes with a very solid steel mallet that is "one time use only" and discarded at the end of the procedure. Needles and blades are understandably disposable; but 3 pounds of solid steel going in the trash after a procedure is inexcusable.
hey, retards.
is this conspiracy happening everywhere in the world at the same time?
To get into med school you have to demonstrate you can understand many very disparate things. You won't use a lot of the actual knowledge but you acquire the skills to learn a lot of very difficult interconnected things.
Once in medschool you are sent through the meat grinder of Lear in everything human anatomy, diseases, treatments, technologies, etc. Sometimes the brainlet that pass just had excellent memories.
>Professional organization, whose members make are highly paid, actively lobby to prevent similar professions from having similar privlages.
>There is a shortage of this needed profession, which drives prices for their services up
>There are no efforts to train more of needed profession, despite there being numerous qualified applicants.
I am not saying all physicians are greedy assholes; but there are enough to fight for a government sanctioned monopoly worth billions of dollars to its members. So please, offer some alternative explanation if there isn't lobbying efforts to create such a monopoly, I'll wait.
*Sips Coffee*
This
I worked a trade that worked directly for physicians while going to college for something unrelated. The politics in pre-med are absolutely nuts, and working with some physicians I can tell which ones were gunners in undergrad.
>I'll wait.
>*Sips Coffee*
>be a little rich
>build private university specialized in medicinal science that accepts average students in pre med.
>get $$$
why is no one is doing this?
also
>a government sanctioned monopoly worth billions of dollars to its members.
which one? Is every government connected to a conspiracy to prevent people from studying medicine? Are doctors in north korea are connected with doctors in the united states for the conspiracy to work?
we are obviously discussing doctors in the usa you autist
but the same problem in OP happens in EVERY country, fucking idiot.
No, it doesn't. Doctors are paid vastly less in other countries and they can't just go work in the US because they have to get certified, which isn't easy.
wrong
Yes they do get paid a lot higher than other stem field all around the world. In the usa they get paid better because of privatised hospitals
They should train doctors like military personnel. Paid directly from the government. Government pays training for fitting recruits.
>pathologists
Medfag here.
I don't think you know what a pathologist is. Pathologists are physicians. It's a five year residency after medical school. Plus most pathologists do a 1-2 year fellowship after residency nowadays. They are probably the most knowledgeable doctors in any given hospital.
Short answer is yes it is that complex and if you want to be any good it requires the memorization of vast quantities of data much of which is formatted arbitrarily and from an earlier time and hasnt been updated because of convention. Your perception of "flawless grades" is just right out the window. Just like every other academic discipline there is a scale of quality that exists and you dont need to ace absolutely everything to be on the bottom end. That being said generally even the lowest ranked med schools are still reasonably competitive because of the number of applicants but tbqh if you are serious about it and have a head on your shoulders you can get in.
>why do the people who treat things that can kill you if left untreated have to be smart.
So you don't kill a whole bunch of people through gross incompetence or ignorance.
Yea and these cucks are forced to do premed first, to be 'well rounded'.
Why would anyone do Medicine over Dentistry? There's more money in Dentistry, QT grills, you can open your own surgery and is less stresfull. In Medicine, you stick your hands up someone's arse. In Dentistry, you use your hands to do complex surgery.
Don't understand desu.
t. predent
The idea of being a doctor is more appealing. It's not logical, it's emotional.
You either get into dentistry for the money or because you couldn't get into med school. Nobody gives a fuck about being a dentist, in my experience.
t. med
also
>a black doctor
does that really happen
>do complex surgery
Not unless they qualify in specialties such as oral and maxillofacial surgery, which do require MDs. Otherwise, you can't do anything other than clean plaque (or straighten them, if you decide to be an orthodontist).
>does that really happen
Ben Carson is an unfortunate example. Excellent at neurosurgery, idiot at everything else.
""""pre""""dentcuck in full denial right now.
I already have my offer m8 so im not in full denial. I have a brother that is doing medicine and i've never seen the appeal for it. You work like a dog to get qualified and get treated like shit by patients. And to become a succesful surgeon it requires like 5+ years of extra training.
I legit want someone to properly explain why med > dent
Thats standard specialization though. It's not super hard to learn that stuff.
>doc brings scalpel close to your eye
>"ok uhhhh... i think it goes something like this?"
>"whoops"
>"uh, nurse, you wanna take a look at this?"
>*starts sweating profusely*
>ends up just poking your eye around and hopes you see a little better
>puts the bandage on you and says its gonna be while before you get to see again
Both premeds and predents are a fucking scourge on the biology undergraduate major. If you're studying biology just because you want to get money and prestige then you're ruining it for people who are actually passionate about biology. Go jump off a cliff.
the general practitioners are the ones who went to shitty schools and had bad grades
Because in dentistry you are stuck in dentistry. People appreciate the degree of freedom being in med provides - it seems like an endless field of possibilities as opposed to "pull teeth" or "do surgery of the jaw" in dentistry. Also for most, dentistry doesn't feel like you've done your very best, it's almost there but not quite (as put it).
tl;dr: dentistry = cuck homos, med best 5,00/5,00
depending on the mallet there might be no safe way to sterilize it for re-use
I didn't do a biology undergraduate major. This is the first time I'm applying to university you moron. I agree with what you say but that doesn't apply to me so fuck you man.
I can sort of see it that way but I'm after a nice life. Medicine seems too stresful and who gives a shit what other people think about your status. From objective factors, I only say that Dentistry > Medicine. But I agree with , although I dont fully grasp that mindset.
cause dentists are weirdos who are hyper-focused on teeth. they creep me out.
Nobody is passionate about biology
The retards who are telling you that AMA controls the supply is wrong. Fed govt funds residency programs and it is the limiting factor in medical education.
I have yet to come across a medical doctor who had good problem solving ability.
Even "specialists".
And I've met quite a few.
Being able to memorize a fucking book while being unable to connect the dots makes you as useful as someone who can't even read.
please no user, now i have to post it:
youtube.com
what has Veeky Forums done to me.
You dont need perfect grades if you are a nigger, a spic or a gook
>a gook
About that...
>but that happens constantly
It's the third leading cause of death in the US.
>a gook
asians need better MCATs and GPAs across the board to get into med school.
Because the average person is a monumental fuck up 90% of the time. People who become doctors usually don't fuck up that much.
A manager of a zoo probably have a more complex and difficult day to solve with life or death consequences, with no education requirements, so the whole thing is charades.
There's a competition for social status and that's all.
How true is this though? I see tons of geniuses not doing Medicine and tons of dickheads who fuck about in Uni doing Medicine. I have friends who are doing Medicine who I would not dare dream of letting them diagnose me.
Hey perfect thread. My legs from about mid calf down to the tips of my toes itch badly, I’ve been using anti fungus stuff, lotion for moisture, even tried Listerine cause my grandmother suggested it. They still itch really badly. Any idea why?
You can't just open your own university and offer medical degrees. In order to get licensed to practice you have to go to the governing medical body that regulates the profession. Here in Canada that is the College of Physicians and Surgeons.
Some historical context may be useful. The College used to be more like a guild. When the Government of Canada wanted to organize healthcare, the doctors revolted and threatened to not work. It was actually a lot like in the US where they thought it was collectivist bullshit. So in order to implement a national healthcare system that actually had doctors working in it, the Government agreed to let the College regulate their own members. That included things like decide who gets in and how many people get in. The caveat is that they have to provide at least a certain amount, which of course they keep artificially low.
So the governing body of Canadian physicians is not the government, but what is essentially the "Doctors Union".
So if you were to try to open this university in order to push out more doctors, they would just not accredit them so they would be unable to practice medicine.
I don't know if this is also true for other countries, but that's the case here in Canada.
The way medical school selects for talent is fucking retarded. You'll never know if you have the nerves or the dexterity to make it as a surgeon until it's way too fucking late.
Try an antihistamine.
because you already have brainlets who can potentially get you killed right now, engineers, politicians, etc.
It's probably eczema, I have it too. Try using salt water on it. It will hurt like fuck but it does help.
Self reply since I forgot. Also, avoid using scented soaps/body wash, since allergens.
Have, it stops the symptoms but not the problem
Will try thankyou
Thanks again
Some college students go overseas for med school at absurd prices
Sounds like eczema. Like you I was on this regimen of weird balms and shit that don't address the problem and in my case it got really bad (trench foot) before proper treatment began. But this assumes that you have eczema which isn't necessarily true.
Let me recommend first that you see a doctor, and secondarily, cortizone which actually does heal and treat eczema.
well would you rather have a brainlet that´s done it a million times because he doesnt charge an arm and a leg. Or a top medical student with top grades but none of the experience?
This. They've also helped to suppress multiple viable cancer treatments that happened to not be in line with established market interests.
Face it, almost everything in existence is net corrupt. There is no legitimacy out there. I'd almost say there never was, but it's reaching a critical point.
Being a doctor has to be the most over rated profession in terms of intelligence required. It is all memorization.
Because the amount of trust society puts in them
This. But good doctors are also creative and highly intelligent, able to put together information into solutions on the fly under intense pressure situations. I've seen plenty of residents who got through medical school based on hard work and study habits, only to peter out in residency and their early careers because they couldn't actually think for themselves, and only knew "if X, then Y is indicated"
Considering I studied (briefly) medicine as a hobby and often correct our NHS GPs?
I'd say I'd like some [CITATION] on the intelligence of doctors.
more like if X, then Y and Z are predicted in some probability which leads to treatment by A,B,C,D depending on E,F,G but only if H and I are J and then...
>I briefly studied a subject that's so fresh in my brain that I can correct my GP
You should die, do you know what sorts of things go in a doctors mind when you tell him "my leg hurts"?
You reading 2 pages of your shitty symptoms on the Internet while he filters out over 10 years of medical expertise and diagnoses you.
Of course he might be wrong dipshit, does mean you're smarter.