Jupiter missions

When will manned missions to Jupiter and the other outer planets happen, Veeky Forums?

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To clarify:
Obviously the OP pic is a fantastical representation, as the crew would be fried by radiation being so close...

But it seems like a waste to focus on just the Mars meme when there's so much clay out there.
What gives?

>manned missions to Jupiter

Why? The moons are of more interest for humans to land on. But, everything can be done via robots. The only reason humans should go anywhere is to colonize and that is super difficult with most of the stuff in the system. Manned bases aren't even needed since robots can do everything there as well.

haven't we already sent like a module or something there?

Solar is useless past mars.

TRGs don't put put enough power.

You need a fission reactor for manned flight past mars.

>Solar is useless past mars

Nonsense. One could argue that Mars is a dead rock and a moon like Europa might even have life.

solar panels are useless past mars, because there simply isn't enough solar energy.

at earth. you get 1 kilowatt per meter squared. at mars it is 500 watts per meter squared.

your best solar panel is 46% efficient under ideal conditions. so on earth you are getting 460 watts per m^2, and 230 watts per m^2 on Mars.

jupiter gets 50 watts per m^2. so a solar panel would get you 23 watts per m^2.

Juno is solar powered and orbiting Jupiter. though this is fine for a probe. where the power budget was carefully calculated before it even took off.

manned vessels would have a much greater energy requirement.

Really? Don't they use ionizing radiation from fast decaying radioactive elements like plutonium or something in order to simulate the mechanism of solar panels? The so called atomic batteries?

Thermonuclear Radioisotope Generators.

They're great if you need a little bit of energy for a very long time. Which makes them great for probes and rovers.

You want to keep humans alive and comfortable. You need tens/hundreds of kilowatts of power a day.

apollo missions had 3 hydrogen fuel cell stacks just for the command module. each one produced 500-2300 watts. they only lasted for 8 days and supported 3 people in austere conditions.

Can't Jupiters radiation be somehow used to generate/store useful energy?

they are as far away as Jupiter

>fried by radiation being so close...
wut?

It's Jupiter, not the Sun

Explain yourself

Jupiter has intense ionizing radiation belts.

astrobio.net/news-exclusive/hiding-from-jupiters-radiation/

manned flight around Jupiter would require a strong magnetic field around the ship to serve as a deflection shield.

>>manned flight around Jupiter would require a strong magnetic field around the ship
Or a fuck ton of mass.either way you need big ass radiators for your reactor.

what about this anons question? it does seems like a great idea to make use of its radiation instead of fighting it

In theory you can harness energy from everything but in practice its easier to bring few kgs of weapons grade Uranium oxide or Plutonium oxide and tons of support structure for your reactor.

Geothermal energy from Io will power the Jovian system.

>When will manned missions to Jupiter and the other outer planets happen
For Jupiter I think it will be between 2050 and 2100. That's of course if human spaceflight booms from things like government-led bases on the Moon and a SpaceX Mars colony. Those destinations will become stale by 2050 if people start landing on them in the 2020s or 2030s.

>manned flight around Jupiter would require a strong magnetic field around the ship to serve as a deflection shield.
Or just a thick radiation shield, which is advisable anyway for long deep-space journeys due to cosmic rays.

>manned missions

Never. We'll blow ourselves up first.

Just use a bigger solar panel you fucking idiot

Lmao how dumb are you

I think an electromagnetic field would be better, weighs less and it's easier to envision in the future than rockets working so much better that we just don't care for the extra weight.

44 square meters of solar panel to produce 1 kilowatt at Jupiter.

that is about the size of one floor of this house.

now the Spaceshuttle consumed 14 kilowatts for the crew and 7 for payloads. that was for 7 people in low earth orbit.

you would have to have several football fields of panels, to support something like the BFR out at jupiter.

>solar panels are useless past mars, because there simply isn't enough solar energy.
dumb stupid brainlet

Jupiter gives off more heat than it receives from the Sun.

>Saturn
>favorite planet
>shit moons

why??????

Jupiter has a magnetosphere that is a region where radiation from the sun, and volcanic emissions from Jupiter's moons and ring, interact with the planet's magnetic field. This interaction creates a region of intense radiation tens of thousands times stronger than the Earth's Van Allen Radiation Belt. The Van Allen Radiation Belt is justifiably speculated to be fatal to mankind while passing through, So Jupiter is off limits.... for now.

apollo astronauts survived.

i wouldn't want to live there.

Sorry, you're right. The Van Allen Belt isn't as bad as speculated, that's just what I grew up with.

Huh. Just like your post, when I eat fresh cherries, I fart like crazy. Neither has anything to do with solar panels.

sure, it is possible to use solar. but the area of panels needed make sit impractical. it also means you have to stay in the sun. Which becomes a problem when you want to orbit or land on gas giant moons.

it is better to bring a proper fission reactor. then at least all that mass is worth it. as you have reliable and vast power for years.

>you would have to have several football fields of panels, to support something like the BFR out at jupiter

Then build them! There's no gravity in space (therefore no vast structural loads from a heavy set of solar panels), and no air resistance (causing aerodynamic stress on such a large surface area solar panel) - so why not build a massive solar panel array? No reason not to!

>titan
>iapetus
>enceladus
>bad
brainlet detected

wtf dude are you smoking
it’s RTG (Radioisotope Thermoelectric Generator)

they passed through the (comparatively) somewhat calm parts

cost
and you probably have to ship materials up to build the huge panels (unless ISRU)

A better question to ask is what would we put in a BFR for a manned(~5 people) mission to callisto? Assume BFR works according to Musk's specs. Support your answers with math.
>> can be done with robots
For some moons like europa, the only practical option is robots. 1 day of exposure to radiation on the europan surface is enough to kill.

Is there ever really any real benefit of space travel? Unless we're colonizing it's not worth it. The implications of traveling or connecting to any mass which lands on this other planet would be fucking retarded.

The Van Allen belt being a force field of death that fries anything passing through it is a myth that is only peddled by moon landing hoaxers now.

The biggest problem with Jupiter is that no moons have an atmosphere

So no Aerobraking possible

Very shitty

Not really, people have this stupid fetish in sending useless probes/rovers/satellites/footprints + flags missions

Is there any real benefit to art? What about sightseeing? Why go visit a place when you could just look at pictures of it online.
Jupiters radiation belts are the real life version of what Moon hoaxers believe Earth's are. They are thousands of times stronger than Earth's.

they still have mass, inertia, and momentum.

any time the ship applied thrust in any direction. it would apply stress to the huge and thin solar arrays.

Can someone tell me why the FUCK we haven't landed on another celestial body since 1969?

I mean for fuck's sake, we landed on the moon before iPhones, before Sony Walkmans, before Michael Jackson - even before Led Zeppelin IV.

So why the FUCK haven't we landed on another planet/moon/whatever in all this time?

Because only brainlets want to spend millions for nothing.

>going to another celestial body is nothing
Brainlet detected

But we did. We landed on the Moon, Venus, Mars, Asteroids, a Comet, Titan.

Robots count to.

>look mom! i went to x location for nothing!

oh nigger they got you good. lol. make sure you brush up on your niel tyson chicken quotes and watch the abc documentary on the knights of the round table starring jamie fox and beyonce

When humans become immune to radiation, of course!

No they fucking don't you stupid twat

I want humans back on another celestial body AS SOON AS FUCKING POSSIBLE

I'm really disappointed there's no talk of putting an ISS+ scale outpost on the Moon. It's something we could actually do with current technology, money and politics, without the 20-year R&D programs or massive unknowns like Mars plans have.

Or a small scale fusion reactor powered by the deuterium / tritium combination, that would be the best thing.

We're almost there ITER project is opening in 8 years expect everything!!!

Actually there are a lot of resources (minerals, rare metals etc) in space, and there are already companies who plan to send robots and then manned missions to recover them.

Check

planetaryresources.com/

>Can someone tell me why the FUCK we haven't landed on another celestial body since 1969?

There's no point unless you are colonizing, setting up a special base for mining, or similar thing. There's very little out there that would be viable for colonizing that an O'Neil cylinder wouldn't be a cheaper and better option. Oh, and mining isn't really worth all that much for Earth. We have plenty of resources. It is worth far more kept in space and used for space things, like building O'Neil cylinders.

It is cheaper and more economically viable to mine what Earth already has. We literally can't run out for another 100k years. Keep the materials in space to use in space.

>Don't they use ionizing radiation
No
> from fast decaying
No
> radioactive elements like plutonium
No
> or something
Well, yes
> in order to simulate
No
> the mechanism of solar panels?
No
> The so called atomic batteries?
No

I sincerely hope this cleared up things.

>manned flight around Jupiter would require a strong magnetic field around the ship to serve as a deflection shield.
No. A magnetic field does not deflect neutral particles.

>Or a fuck ton of mass.
Which would be hopeless to launch.
>either way you need big ass radiators for your reactor.
No. The radiators for the RTGs so far have been small. Scaling up means you scale up emissive surface areas but that doesn't have to be huge.

manned missions to jupiter is a meme, there's no gain in getting close enough into the range of jupiters consciousness that it might take notice of us

It might not even recognize us as intelligent life. We'll have to bring a big enough radio antenna to catch its attention.

Oldspace to the rescue. Expect such outpost by the end of the century if all goes well.

Except that the US and Russia have agreed on building a lunar orbital station so they can more easily test manned missions to celestial bodies. The return is going to happen. The only drop of bitterness is that they're going to decommission their only terrestrial orbital station in exchange, leaving the Earth's orbit to the fucking Chinese.