Death theory

You're

Ok, then it's like when you're knocked out. I've been out many times and you don't remember any of the time you're unconscious. If you died, it would stay like this.

I think the same.

Can you remember before you were born? No. So will it be after your death. Why do I have the feeling you are a christard? Because I hope you are not.

I meant I think the same thing as OP.

That's not a theory

If the soul is real, then it must have energy. Where is that energy transferred when we die?

If that was the case, would time go by like it does when you are unconsious? Its an odd thong to think about, because time flies during unconsiousness, but for those who tell of there experience, there is always that point where they exit the time warp when they eventually wake up.

Energy does not appear out of thin air, at least as far as I know. Something happened to create everything that exists. And it may well be way above what we can ever comprehend.

>i have this theory

aaaannnndd dropped.

If somthing cannot be created from nothing, then why does everything exist? I think that rule would apply in any parralell universe in some way. Everything has a start, no matter how big or small.

Who are you talking to

I like to think that we go to an absolute paradise when we die. The alternative possibilities are dreadful, and remove all hope in life.

>If somthing cannot be created from nothing, then why does everything exist?
Why was there nothing?

Nobody really, these thoughts go through my head alot, I just felt like letting them out to whoever will listen, and hopefully discuss.

OP, this is one fucking retarded post.

Well, it seems inconcievable to me that somthing would just exist without starting from somewhere.

>Can you remember before you were born? No.

I don't believe in the after life but this argument is fucking retarded, and I can't stand teenagers like you spouting it like it's some kind of clever, original thought.
It's like saying "can you remember the taste of something you've never eaten before? no, then that means said thing is flavourless". It's really shitty rhetoric.

Enjoy your argumentum ad infinitum, brainlet.

Most likely answer: the idea of nothing is a human construct, so asking "why" there is something instead of nothing, or where that something came from, is illogical.

If the soul exists, then its ability to remain consious may depend on a brains memory? Without it, what happens?

>It's really shitty rhetoric.
As are any discussions on the afterlife.

It's called eternal oblivion
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_oblivion
Quite a medieval sounding term for atheist heaven, and heaven indeed is what to call it considering it implies no consequence for the selfishness, neglect and decadence most practice over the course of their lives.

That makes a lot of sense.

Sure, but if you're going to call people retards for believing in something you don't, at least try to have decent arguments. This was low effort, YouTube comment tier.

...

Im gonna be dissapointed if when I die, theres just nothing. No god, no reception party put together by all my dead ancestors, no attractive women, no loved ones, nothing.

>and heaven indeed is what to call it considering it implies no consequence for the selfishness, neglect and decadence most practice over the course of their lives.
So like normal heaven then? Just because you would rather believe something ridiculous doesn't mean it will actually happen. The only consequences for your actions are the ones here on earth.

Perhaps everything has a beginning, but the chain of beginnings never ends. Or perhaps these things are outside of our understanding of time and causality.

No, faggot, it's the cessation of consciousness, nothing, nada de todo, what OP is describing is called Eternal Oblivion. It's a heaven for bad people and a hell for good people, as it means you can do anything you want in live and be free of consequence.

All living things tend to move and act on the known or hoped for promise of reward. (Plants grow towards sunlight in the hopes thqt there is promise of more sunlight). And in doing so, they sometimes take risks. I dont know who said it, but somone once said, "the journey is the destination". So is the journey of life heaven? When ones life is filled with killing, conflict, and war, is his life not often hell?

>"can you remember the taste of something you've never eaten before? no, then that means said thing is flavourless"
That attempted analogy doesn't work for a couple reasons, the bigger reason being that you're trying to compare the memories of someone who's alive before, during, and after the event in your example with the memories of someone who isn't alive before, is alive during, and isn't alive after the event in the target of your attempted analogy. Analogies don't work like that. If you want to make one that does work you would need to use an example that doesn't include the thing you're trying to compare to, like:
There isn't such a thing as the sustained wind speed of a hurricane before it forms and there isn't such a thing as the sustained wind speed of a hurricane after it dissipates.

And a miserable person dies happy, and a happy person dies miserable, this is the entire concept behind Buddism, although in buddism your conciousness is recycled unto a new host organism, the quality of which is determined by your prior conduct.

There was always something, even if there wasn't time, there was something else

You're low effort, YouTube comment tier.

>Im gonna be dissapointed if when I die, theres just nothing.
No you aren't. If you're still around to be disappointed then you didn't die in the first place.
>when we die, it's like eternal sleeping without a dream. You don't see anything, you don't feel anything, you don't even know you're there.
There isn't any you left to either feel or not feel anything if you're dead. So no, it's not like that. If you're imagining there's any sort of experience being dead is like then you're missing the point that there's nobody there to experience anything anymore.

Either you go to heaven or hell
/thread.

You effectively die whenever you sleep: the area of the brain that is thought to be responsible for self-awareness goes into a very deactivated state when you sleep.

So, therefore, dying will be similar to sleep, except eventually 'you' will wake up when your brain information is recreated by some means in the 'future'.

I have this theory that when you die, the brain stops functioning and turns into dirt like the rest of your body.

Your thoughts like the words on burning paper.

And the world goes on.

>its just a theory man.
nice to see that you don't have any mathematical training what so ever.

You can't have decent arguments for such a debate.

How is that a theory? Is this bait? That’s literally the general consensus among any non-religious people on the planet. Wht are you 12? I have so many questions.

>Use HYPOTHESIS when you make a testable statement.
Except we should be encouraging op to test this

"death equals nothingness" is a logical impossibility and that makes me fear it, because I don't know what it will actually be like. What if you just remain frozen in your own perception of the last instants of your life, like you bugged out? It would be worse than any religious hell I could think of. And there's no reason to think the workings of reality (which don't give a fuck about our consciousness) would be arranged in such a way that something like this, or worse, won't be what happens

I just assume it'll be exactly like it was for me before I was born.

but you're freaking me out mann

WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE

>"death equals nothingness" is a logical impossibility
What? No it isn't. What "logic" do you think suggests that?
You didn't have any existence before being born and you won't after dying. Your existence in time has a pretty straightforward beginning and ending to it, just like how objects in space have boundaries.
Far from being impossible, that's exactly how every event we know of that takes place in time plays out. Even the entire observable universe itself had a beginning and appears to be heading towards a heat death ending. If anything's "illogical" it'd be an event that goes on forever.

the argument about before being born is literally the reason it's a logical impossibility. you can't access the time before you were born, so you will likewise never access that supposed "nothingess" of death. as a consciousness you're constrained to always be experiencing soemething, by necessity. what exactly that would be is the unsolvable question.

>you can't access the time before you were born,
Correct.
>so you will likewise never access that supposed "nothingess" of death.
Also true, there is no you left after you die.
>as a consciousness you're constrained to always be experiencing soemething, by necessity
OK, and that something you're experiencing is everything between when you're born and when you die.
>what exactly that would be is the unsolvable question.
Now where are you getting that from? There's no problem here. You are a finite process with a beginning and an ending. All the time while you're conscious you're conscious of something, fine. Where are you getting that death and the cessation of consciousness is a problem then? If there's no you left to experience anything then there's no problem with there not being anything to experience after death.

Original thread maker here. Thanks for having this convo, it's been interesting to see some different points of views

because "cessation of consciousness" is a made up thing that nobody ever in history has ever experienced. being knocked out looks from the 3rd-person like cessation of consciousness, but from the 1st person you just atemporally "skip" all time. Even if it's a years-long comma. Same reasoning applies for the billions of years before you "started" consciousness and same will apply to death. I can concede that maybe using the birth analogy, the possibility of you getting "bugged out" might not be there, if the process is the same but in reverse.

You say "Theorem" for a proven theory you fucking retard

Thank you ^

to clarify, i'm not arguing for the generic sort of afterlife where the sense of "you" that exists during life progresses unaltered with all memories. I believe all attributes of consciousness are tied to brain function, therefore they will stop existing. But the fact of 'existing' is prior to anything else imo. And I don't hold this only for consciousness, the same could apply to any reality. I'd almost say there's no difference between "reality" and "subjective awareness" when you go down to the most base, fundamental level. Kinda like some sort of panpsychism

>nobody ever in history has ever experienced [cessation of consciousness]
Obviously not because cessation of consciousness means there's nobody left to experience anything. It's inane to expect the absence of someone to experience not existing. That'd be like wondering what the fourth act of a three act play is about.
>being knocked out looks from the 3rd-person like cessation of consciousness, but from the 1st person you just atemporally "skip" all time.
Sure, yes.
>Same reasoning applies for the billions of years before you "started" consciousness and same will apply to death.
If you mean the same as in there's no experience before death and no experience after death then I agree. I again don't see how this is a problem though.

>But the fact of 'existing' is prior to anything else imo.
But you don't really believe that because you already said yourself that there's no experience while you're unconscious and your awareness just goes from before being unconscious straight to the point when you're no longer unconscious.
If your existence as a conscious observer were really prior to anything else then a physical / chemical event wouldn't be able to make your conscious observation stop happening.

The problem is that your 1st-person will always remain existing regardless of what happens from an outside perspective (bodily death, in this case). Much in the same way you can't exactly pinpoint the beginning of your own experience and when you start to ponder it, it seems as if it was always there even though you 'know' that from a 3rd-person view time existed before your body was assembled.

You can only ascertain that you were unconscious through projecting a 3rd-person view and comparing it with your 1st-person experience. Once again, from the perspective of inside your experience there is no discontinuity nor void. It is just more useful for life and survival to act as if there was, because all the stuff we see as external tells us so.

Try reading my post again.

I have this theory that when you die it is just like the time before you were conceived. You feel and experience the exact same things.

>your 1st-person will always remain existing regardless of what happens from an outside perspective (bodily death, in this case)
Except it doesn't do that.
>Much in the same way you can't exactly pinpoint the beginning of your own experience and when you start to ponder it
That's because your cognitive processes don't magically emerge with perfect fidelity all at once at the same unified moment in the time. Babies develop different cognitive processes including the capacity for storing long term memories gradually. Memories also aren't kept separate from beliefs about what you remember. You can have beliefs that form over time about what you think you remember even though you might not have ever experienced the topic of those apparent memories in reality. And the less you use memories the more the connections that support the existence of those memories will weaken and fall apart. So it's natural that the further back you think to the fuzzier your memories will seem.
>it seems as if it was always there
I don't get that impression about my memories and I'm not sure where you get it from either. Having a fuzzy and difficult to remember distant past doesn't equate to feeling like you've always existed. That's something extra specific to you that I think you're imagining on top of the situation.
>from the perspective of inside your experience there is no discontinuity nor void
There's a discontinuity if it was day out and in your room when you went unconscious and it's night out and in a hospital room when you regain consciousness. You don't need to have an experience in between those two moments to experience a discontinuity in your experience of the one moment compared to the other moment. And that doesn't depend on a third person view either. Your own first person view picks up on a discontinuity just by comparing the one moment of experience with the other moment of experience and noticing they don't sync like normal sequential moments in your experience.

How do you get to become OP

Thanks for writing down what I felt when reading OPs post.

I couldn't have done better.

No you can be brought back from a coma

-It's not rhetoric, it's a legitimate argument
-Your analogy fails as explained by -I didn't say it like it was an original thought at all, just a good argument just as sleeping as without conscience.

I recommend you to put reason above skepticism.

can you fuck off

You just suck big ol demon dicks in hell. Nothing much to it

And then you come back and post this thread because the big crunch + determinism is true.

Stfu you douche

I don't get this stupid fucking argument.
You don't remember when you were a fucking baby either, you don't even remember 90% of last week, that doesn't mean you weren't conscious and existed as a baby or last week.

quaker

google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=newssearch&cd=5&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjlpaDr7a7XAhVGRCYKHdXDBu0QqQIINSgAMAQ&url=https://www.healthline.com/health-news/we-may-still-be-conscious-after-we-die&usg=AOvVaw0c2Mf-aePxdfTM726D-hdD

just read this.

occam's razor

I could only hope for this.

What kind of retard complaint attempt is that? Nobody's arguing it's impossible to have an experience and then forget it. They're just correctly pointing out that you already have an example of a time where you don't exist in the past before you were born so use that as your reference point for understanding how the time where you don't exist in the future after you're dead works.

>can you remember before you were born?
I encourage you to call me a liar, but I actually do remember. however, I don't remember much at all except for always seeing a dark red, wet surface. if it wasn't from shortly before I was born, it was certainly my earliest memory

You aren't a liar, you're just overly trusting of your own mental processes. That was your imagination which you misinterpretted as a literal real life memory, probably a long time ago, maybe in a dream.

Asking what happens to your consciousness after you die is like asking what happens to Windows after you wreck your hard drive. It's gone, man. Ya broke it.

>overly trusting of your memory
quite the opposite, I don't have good memory so there's a bit of contrast between what I certainly do remember and what probably didn't happen. who knows.

>what I certainly do remember
You don't "certainly" remember anything. Memory is fallible as fuck for everyone, if what you think is a memory is premised in something ridiculous like remembering what your mother's womb looked like then the sane choice is to realize that's not an actual memory at all.

>implying i can't tell the difference between a real memory and something that likely didn't happen
so you think I wasn't agreeing with what you were saying?.

well since we cant and don't understand consciousness there's no guarantee its not conserved. Why is reincarnation not a more popular belief? I'm in fact here once, why cant i be here again?

>I'm in fact here once, why cant i be here again?
Sure but you have to wait for the universe to reboot.
Universe 1000298383^1003837737929 rebooting.
Please wait for 4.5 billion years.
Ok go.

If you believe you had a memory of the womb then you don't agree with what I'm saying.

>memory of the womb
k..

>I'm in fact here once, why cant i be here again?
Think more about what "I" means in this context. It's a useful way of grouping together different thinks associated with a body over time, but that's all it is. There isn't any magic "self" module in the body in the first place that could ever be recreated in the future to make "you" teleport from the moment of death to a new moment of birth.

What are you talking about? You said memory before you were born. What the fuck else would that be if not a womb memory?

i mean sure there's no way to quantify who's who in any situation but it could hypothetically be true... you just cant prove it in any way...
who says the universe needs to reboot, why cant i come back as a big titty goth gf in 5 years... or as Hitler, or Scooby Doo?

You don't remember shit about it. How the fuck is it a reference if you dont know shit about what was happening then. Theres no conclusion to draw from the statement other than "you dont remember because it was long ago, same as when you were a baby"

Our dynamic higher-self in the Astral plane, that looks like a luminiscient humanoid in pic related oscillating between chaotic sun flares and concentrated order, convened with a metaphysical council to cast down a lower conscious level corporeal projection of itself with your life planned out in advance. As this pseudo-proxy you have some journey of self-discovery with a goal, probably data collection, that you're unknowingly guided toward. You're can convene to an extent with your Atman ubermench, if your long-term and consistent meditation practice rears success, or you're allowed to use a gameshark and take dmt. Once you return to the great beyond, you'll realize that you were contributing to a sentient cosmic cloud computer that receives uploads from agents of the physical plane for some mind boggling grand purposes, the simpler one being to develop ideal realities in contrast to the unnecessary flaws and toxicity in this one. You're part of a super mega project essentially but you chose to start off in this crappy little ant farm as you originally transcend time and human life span is insignificant from such perspective. You can think of this one reality as a mission you started in a hub (that dmt crystal palace) after you convened with other volunteers who will be both your friends and enemies influencing your actions here. There's more but I'll stop there for now. I'm not certain what are those crystal machines those machine elves operate. The human brain is as effective as a commodore 64 when faced with that realm. It's why people have a hard time articulating such experiences. Language doesn't do it justice. Also there was an article recently where a guy died on the operating table and had the same NDE experience with the setting and entity on dmt decades later.

>who says the universe needs to reboot, why cant i come back as a big titty goth gf in 5 years... or as Hitler, or Scooby Doo?
No the universe reboots after the singularity.
20 new parameters are chosen and tada!
Sometimes you're you, sometimes a deck chair, sometimes you're Hitler and sometimes you're just a shade of blue.
You samsara faggots are so dumb.
Its sequential dummy, not parallel.

Or your temporal lobes shutdown along with the rest of the brain and you're to float above your body and chill on the hospital roof where you an out of place lost shoe, then get resuscitated from NDE and the doctors think you hallucinations it all until they check the roof and find the specifically described shoe. NDE studies are a blast to read