>Mfw when I realized there never was a problem.
Hard Problem of Consciousness?
Nathaniel Johnson
Other urls found in this thread:
evolvingai.org
en.wikipedia.org
twitter.com
Bentley Moore
Good, but posting those words is like saying "beetlejuice" three times for pseudointellectuals. Hurry and delete this thread.
Adam Sanders
Whatever the answer is, we can all agree that dualism is bullshit, correct?
Jaxon Walker
Correct. It's incredibly egotistical how these "hard problem" people are convinced their own compelled belief in sensory input as some "experience" thing in itself is a literal indication of some aspect of reality that physics is missing. Instead of the obvious alternative explanation that we're just prone to having a useful belief in something that isn't literally true. Like somehow they've convinced themselves it's impossible for the brain to ever work in terms of convenient fictions.
Josiah Clark
Hate to break it to you, mr. folk psychologist, Qualia doesn't exist
John Wood
He's agreeing with you and saying it's going to attract the people you two don't agree with by triggering them with the truth. He's saying delete the thread so you don't have to deal with these incoming brainlets, not because you're wrong.
Carson Lee
Hmm I'm dumb as shit
Jack Ramirez
brainlet here, please explain in more detail
Jaxson Carter
No you brainlet,close but not right.
It's an illusion in part, in fact, consciousness is the only thing that can see an illusion as real. Only consciousness can look at pic related and model an object which is impossible.
So consciousness is based in illusion, but that does not mean it isn't real. Ultimately, color is real, sound is real, etc. We haven't figured out how to model it correctly yet, but that does not mean it doesn't have real existence, material physical existence. It exists as expressed by the interaction of information in the brain, the same way the universe exists as expressed by the interaction of information making up the fundamental particles.
Consciousness is some kind of real byproduct of the interaction of information. The more complex and correlated the system (for example having eyes with high "framerate" vision tied in with short to long term memory and intelligence to generalize and analyze and form a complex model of the surrounding environment as well as internal environment) the more likelyhood there is strong consciousness.
I'd say that for computers especially neural nets, and especially those mixing visual and verbal dialogue, are approaching higher and higher levels of consciousness. I believe this will be proved shortly after a strong theory of consciousness has been established. I'm not suggesting they have minds, but that they are getting closer and closer as the components of a mind are becoming easy to compute.
Connor Miller
>in fact, consciousness is the only thing that can see an illusion as real
Nope.
evolvingai.org
Also none of what you're talking about needs to involve "qualia" being literally present. All that's required is the behavior of responding to those illusions as though they weren't illusions. It's enough to behave and report as though you're "experiencing qualia" like your examples of color or sound. No literal phantasms of "experience" need ever actually appear and no deeper new science of "qualia" is required unless you insist on overrating the literal reality of your compelled belief and behavior in these situations. It's way less of a leap to just accept that you only believe you're "really experiencing" something rather than overhauling physics because of how real you're compelled to believe / report the alleged phenomena are. Intensity of belief doesn't constitute much evidence that belief is true instead of just a useful fictional reference point for behavior.