This has puzzled me for some time now, sci...

this has puzzled me for some time now, sci. idk how anyone continues thinking this universe is a wondrous place when they learn it is in a state of perpetual decay. ever since i learned about thermodynamics i found whatever spark i had to study pointless. why build a sand castle when the shore will just swallow it up? why delude myself into this "hurr durr wonders of the universe shit" when deep down this is a wretched place?

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It would arguably be way more horrifying if things didn't decay and you were forced to continue living for billions of years with no exit.

>clinging to the illusion of permanence

more like
>permanence is an illusion
>therefore universe sucks

If it wasn't for increasing entropy we wouldn't have stars.
The Earth, over the course of a year, radiates just as much energy back into space as it receives from the Sun, but at longer wavelengths/lower temperature. So the Earth rids itself of "accumulated" entropy and life continues.

Old joke.
Astronomer lectures that the Sun will expand, engulf Earth, and then shrink into a white dwarf in four billion years.
Shaky voice from rear of auditorium asks him to repeat that.
"Four billion years."
Questioner, much relieved, says "Thank goodness! I thought you said four MILLION."

Don't let it get you down. You're going to die someday. Does that make everything pointless? Might as well kill yourself now and avoid the agony.
For the present, you're alive. Make the most of it! Try to leave the world better than you found it.

I think his argument is that if you think it sucks to not have permanence it's because you mistakenly believed in an idea that never actually made any coherent sense in the first place.
A number of Buddhist philosophical writings make a similar argument where they not only assert that permanence is illusory but further assert that even just the mere belief permanence is a coherent idea that *could* exist is a mistake.

Another anti-nihilism thread? Yawn. It's no wonder you want eternity to exist considering how much time you waste not living your short and meaningless life.

well, i could just say because the universe is such that permanence doesn't even make sense it sucks. but i do understand the pt you're getting at. it's just that i don't think you can understand decay without understanding the concept of permanence. it's the mechanism of its negation.

i want an indefinite meaningless life. is that so much to ask for?

But is that a (valid) reason to be depressed?

Actually, I'd have thought Buddhists would believe in the long-term past and future (though maybe not 'forever'). With their cycles and cycles of cycles, etc. theirs is the only religion I know of that comes even close to envisioning the actual time scales of the cosmos.
6000 years or so is comparatively instantaneous, a product of minds lacking imagination.

>You start deluding yourself into thinking it's possible through miracles in science or whatever. Before you know it you're on your death bed not having done anything you wanted to do and lived out a life less fun than it could have been. If you accepted that life is short however you can use it to your advantage to motivate yourself to do whatever you wanted to do.

user you don't get it. No matter what a person does they will always feel they didn't do enough or they didn't have a the time (I have seen this in people of all stratas of society and level of achievement). Whether they admit it or in their mind they say it (in the same way people get turned on by nubile teens but won't admit it). It's a human thing really to always really care about "time" as a thing because it's always there always present.

Here's the shitty thing about our society is that we are made to feel ashamed about our feelings instead of being truthful about it so no one really brings it up until it actually happens and you are all alone. People talk the talk and walk the walk until it actually happens and it's such a shitty thing and everyone just tries to give support and it's fucking useless because they don't experience it until it's too late or can't experience it (like trying to explain the pain of an ovary cyst bursting and you literally collapse on the floor in sheer pain and shitting yourself in the office).

I've seen a grown man cry because that scenario of him not being there to take are about his mentally disabled 17 or so son literally broke him once the actual prospect of that happening occured. Your only son (and living child since his daughter died) can barely take care of himself and what will happen when you are gone since he certainly isn't rich and financially his beloved son needs a ton of care and support. Now this guy who is full of life is literally a shadow of himself

I'm having a really hard time understanding what you're trying to say.

You're right that absolute happiness is not achievable, but I know that when I spend a weekend watching TV and drinking beer all night I am depressed for the next week, but when I spent it studying hard and exercising I feel okay and even positive for the future

Maybe at death you don't feel a future so everything is miserable. It think I will buy this book I saw a while ago written by Cicero (?) on death and what it is like to be old. I want a first person account from an old dude

Will go find and post here

amazon.com/gp/product/0140440992/

"On Old Age" section

expect nietzsche was trying to combat humans from falling into nihilism, and even criticised religion for its nihilistic after life philosophy.

>"I praise, I do not reproach, [nihilism's] arrival. I believe it is one of the greatest crises, a moment of the deepest self-reflection of humanity. Whether man recovers from it, whether he becomes master of this crisis, is a question of his strength!"
Nietzsche wanted nihilism so that we could get to what comes after it.

Study life sciences then.

But Murray is happy now. All of eternity to be the ONE that kills the voice. That's Shounen (not to hate on the work) as fuck lol

Yes but the story is not really about Murray. It's about the eternal mind who created the universe, and what his experience is like.

That is the best part about this and your pic (abstractly).
Since you know everything has to end, then why not enjoy it until it lasts?

You know that phrase of "without sorrow, happiness is nothing" or some shit.
Also the original pls rember is a very abstract form of Hedonism if you have not noticed, in which it is the best philosophical system IMO. Not a normalfag either so don't confuse me.

Oh shit, rereading my post I realize it doesn't make sense.
Nice.

The fact that everything is temporary is the first existential realization in life. When you reach this stage, you usually become a nihilist and that can either make you very sad or very indifferent.

The mathematical improbability of your existence is the second. You shouldn't exist, but you do, due to some ridiculously fine tuned natural constants. Maybe someone planned this or maybe it's the anthropic principle or maybe something else. When you reach this stage, you usually become an opportunist -- "Hey, the fact that I'm even here is ridiculous, and I don't have much time, so I'm going to take this ride for all it's worth." Get money, fuck bitches, etc.

The third is finding a purpose. You know everything is temporary. You know you're lucky to be here. Now, you find something to do with this tiny little instant you have to work with. I can't explain how or why, but once you reach this stage, everything around you starts to fall into place. The vast majority of people DO NOT ever find this third realization. When you work toward your true purpose, everything just starts to make sense. It's not an immediate thing. You don't just see a bright light and suddenly wake up in nirvana. You just find yourself driven to do what you were born to do, and somehow, you now know exactly what that thing is. The bad news is that you also discover "The Resistance." Sounds like some /x/-tier garbage, but it is 100% real. Read "The War of Art" if you want to know more. The author is clearly a little bit crazy, because the end of the book devolves into some kind of weird, religious rant. But the first two sections are everything you need to know.

This
Fucking this

NOTHING PERSONNEL

Indeed.

>But the first two sections are everything you need to know.

That explains you post as well.

>"without sorrow, happiness is nothing"

You know one can exist without the other (or be extremely reduced).

>You know one can exist without the other
Wrong, it is completely impossible to only feel one only, you lose happiness when you feel sorrowful and vice versa as well it would be extremely complex to feel only sorrow or joy.
>(or be extremely reduced).
Correct, this is where Hedonism comes from, as well the questioning on why we should live to suffer for all of our life? I do realize about nihilism points that nothing matters including our emotions, but we feel for a reason and if our life apparently does not matter, you're stilll putting life a meaning per se when you apply nihilism.
Why do you think the "meaning of life" cannot be answered? Just like beauty, it is subjective.

>it is completely impossible to only feel one only,

Try being a shitty third world orphan with nothing to live for with no future and hopes. There are places in the world that what I mentioned isn't really odd

Op, the very act of building defy's the universe. We can put things back together with our own effort and energy after they have decayed; we can actually act against the universe in a way. And that's pretty cool.

The true purpose of any being is to achieve Godhhod and escape/reverse entropy and the heat death of the universe. As written in the book "The last question" by Asimov.

>not just rounding trillions of years to infinity

The two are basically the same for as long as your life is concerned

If permanence is an illusion and a literal non-concept why would what the universe is and will always be, "suck"? OP is just clinging to the non-concept that is permanence.

>shitty third world orphan
>nothing to live for
The orphan is still young if the definition of orphan is still under 18. Most of the time these persons do always find a way to move on in life, especially if they're young and not on the usual age of suicide that is around 25 and over, with 45 to 60's being the most common contrary to popular Veeky Forums belief of suicide around your 20's. Of course I'm not saying nobody kills them self at their 20's.
But getting back to your point is that usually young people try to find a way in difficult times, as well most people in the third world will try to find a small light in the dark because they know since the day they're born that they live a horrible shitty life, and that sole thought makes people more resilient in life overall since they know where they are and do not feel the way you believe about the sorrow only. Also the most amazing thing about resilience in said orphans and third-worlders that had a shitty life is that most either become successful people or bitter as fuck that hate everyone including oneself because they just think about where they are right now and not where they want to be. [spoiler]See Veeky Forums and /r9k/ respectively[/spoiler]
As well I am speaking for my 19 years of third world, and I realize how lucky I am to speak English as well, but one either moves on or becomes a rotten person.

The only true case that sorrow would be the majority is when you're in your 60's and have done absolutely nothing in life and lived as a NEET for over 40 to 50 years or so, just living the same way every day and every year. Or peoples that have lived through a war situation.

Overall, I consider your point a really good one, but having 100% a positive or negative feeling is something I cannot imagine to happen to someone, it would have to be an extreme situation like I have mentioned, but most find a way of course.

So a tl;dr is that it could happen what you said, but only in extreme situations.

>idealism ive been fed through empty entertainment media my whole life constitutes a legitimate life philosophy and worldview

For now, but not in the future when entropy increases too much

Cont. and by extreme situations I practically mean the top 99.9999 per cent of joyful people and 99.9999 per cent of sorrowful people.
These numbers can be just rounded to 100% so you practically have your extremes.

Learn to take a joke

I mean like an aids orphan abandoned at an orphangae to rot isolated in a room and turning feral/semi-autistic because they have no contact with humans at all because the nuns are overworked. This shit happens often (Romania actually had this happen before with the orphanage part and kids rotting in rooms under simulated).

>that sole thought makes people more resilient in life overall since they know where they are and do not feel the way you believe about the sorrow only.

That's literally a "poverty is a virtue" thing.

They know it makes them "more resilient" but they fucking suffered hard because of it and when they do have the chance to make sure their kids never suffer it they would take every single chance. There's parents who would kill if it guaranteed their kids will have a plentiful life.

Using my earlier example being poor makes you "resilient" but having to wake up and go to sleep starving, undernourished and lacking the key resources the middle class and up people have to ensure a good education, worrying about returning home to see an eviction notice.

There's research that shows that this "resilience" leads to mental issue/social issues in reality or the disgruntled "mentality" regardless if they are successful or not.

Lol you dont even understand

The purpose of life is to survive. Maybe one day we've evolved enough to truly know where universe came from and where it will end. Until then, we should just strive to survive, since we obviously are not there yet.

Furthermore, you have billions of ancestors who lived, worked and died so you could come to be. You owe it to them to continue that chain and to give your children life. It might be one of your descendants who becomes the first Übermensch. Maybe he will find out that universe never ends or that it only ends to be reborn. Maybe he'll find something entirely else. Whatever the case, nihilism will get you nowhere. Neither nearer the knowledge of what's to come, nor towards happiness.

You should find meaning the way just about everyone else does. Find yourself a wife, make white children, and make sure your genes survive. Universe will likely be here for the next few trillion years, so you should just live happily with the assumption that your descendants will make sure that everything has not been in vain. All you have to do is allow your descendants to exist in the first place.

For the same reason you can't hold your breath until you pass out.

But, additionally, there's always this story - maybe it'll make you feel better:
youtube.com/watch?v=ojEq-tTjcc0

Besides, assuming we get off this rock, even if we never find a solution, we've got hundreds of trillions of years to worry about that. What in the hell are you gonna build that's gonna last hundreds of trillions of years. I mean, yeah, you can have kids, but by then every last molecule of your genes will be washed out by everyone else's between now and then.