It's weird how aware everyone is of Cyberpunk dystopia in fiction, especially with movies coming out all the time about it, yet there are aspects of it already affecting every day existence.
Does the fact that you are aware of the possibility of encroaching techno-fascism necessarily preclude it from actually happening?
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Of course not, Sterling reached the high point of bitterness around 2006, after his Veridian movement failed completely. Gibson is writing alternate universe sf, Stephenson is writing straight space ship sf, and even Charles Stross threw in the towel because actual events killed his near future sf.
What we are heading for is Mad Max, and Cyberpunk is now a quaint, nostalgic dystopia, which is why it is current again. Meanwhile, all the old cyberpunks and futurists are all just watching the world burn on social media.
Explain the mad Max thing
A desert planet with acidic oceans and islands of plastic?
Mutants and Petrol Nomad Gangs. All that pure unadulterated freedom is gonna be sweeee-itt, I'm tellin yous all.
If we really achieve "pure unadulterated freedom" which i doubt, it's unlikely it's gonna be like Mad Max because most real people don't really have fantasies of being biker BDSM perverts
If anything, certain parts of Neuromancer became far truer today than they were in it's time (the highly disposable, discardable youth culture, per example).
In many ways, it could be argued we are already living in a cyberpunk world, it's just that the real world doesn't wave neither the aesthetic or the tech (yet), and it's unlikely we'll ever get the aesthetic because, again, most real people don't want to live in a city where it's just full on neon and grey cement everywhere.
The notion that we're headed for a Mad Max-esque future rather than a cyberpunk one is ridiculous.
>The notion that we're headed for a Mad Max-esque future rather than a cyberpunk one is ridiculous.
Not if you actually listen to any of the original cyberpunk authors nowadays, or actual science news sources. No point in arguing it though.
The real cyberpunk stage is the 2020-2030s, we're moving ahead at pace, which is why you see it all around you.
But both of my initial points still hold. Nothing precludes it from actually happening, indeed we are straight on track, and you could say the movies, etc., are a kind of frisson, or rubbing it in. But I think it is actually nostalgia, because it is apparent that the world will be uninhabitable in a century.
>the world will be uninhabitable in a century
very likely, pollution, like of resources (and we still wasting said resources as a species), if we're talking a century (rather than a handful of decades like i was implying) then yes, the world would be very inhospitable if not outright uninhabitable.
I think, that within my lifespan (and i don't have that much time left, mind you), the world, or at least the west (i lived in Ghana a couple years, it's holding up alright) is just gonna be an hedonistic, ultra consumerist nightmare with an emphasis on technology.
I don't necessarily disagree with you, mind you, i believe that speculating about the future is always merely speculation, and i try not to go full Nick Land with it.
>yet there are aspects of it already affecting every day existence.
What aspects? We have large cooperations, large scale surveilance, but what else?
>What we are heading for is Mad Max
I'm unsure, I think it can go all kinds of ways, that I'm uncertain about.
>techno-fascism
It seems most fascists actually reject transhumanism; I keep an eye on them. They prefer eugenics and - some - genetic manipulation.
In fact - to me - it looks that transhumanists are mostly liberals, and either classical liberals or leftists, and most but not all of them are white males doing STEM. More like Revenge of the Nerds than Return of the Sith.
>I keep an eye on them
>white males
You're jewish, aren't you?
It's a shame that fascists doesn't like transhumanism. Transhumanazism sounds cool.
The thing about Cyberpunk is that, normal every day working people like sunlight and trees. After a while there would be a backlash on both sides of the isle.
performance enhancing drugs, nanotechnology, sects and cults, race/religion/class wars, hyperadvancing tech, genetic mutation from environmental pollution, space exploration and colonization research, the internet.
Transhumanism is a jewish fantasy, and fascism hasn't been relevant for over 70 years.
I think that's funny but no
I keep an eye on all sorts of ideologies, from social justice stuff, to anarcho-primitivists, fascists and communists - I'm curious and looking for ideas
And I pick up language from all of them. I feel somewhat uneasy at times because I have started thinking in terms of the [..]jew. Think sugarjew or sodajew. It seems that there are people on /pol/ who use jews as cryptoslang while others are genuinely anti-semetic.
>performance enhancing drugs
Nootropics?
>nanotechnology
I don't think we are fully in it untill we are seeing nanobot pollution, but sure.
>sects and cults,
>race/religion/class wars,
Aren't these from every period?
So you're white? It's perfectly normal to be against, and speak out against, jewish behavior; and doing so does not make one an "antisemite," which is not a real word. I don't know anything about pol because I've never posted there, but I've heard the Veeky Forums pol here is now mostly full of shills, and probably jewish shills, who counter-signal white interests etc., so I don't know how much I'd take away from that. Monitoring others' ideas will only take you so far if you understand them merely superficially -- which I'm not necessarily saying you do. But do you know why racially aware whites try to draw attention to jewish behavior? Have you read the Culture of Critique, for instance?
Do you never fucking let up. Get a life.
>constantly on Veeky Forums
>constantly tries to police others' speech
>Get a life.
That's good advice I think you should take.
I might read it to gain some insight, and yes I'm white. But can we go back to the topic please?
We were discussing techno-fascism, and from what've seen most fascists consider themselves traditionalists and while that doesn't mean anti-tech, they tend to be against transhumanism.
I'm not sure what the views on AI are, or other new technologies.
But that aside: what would make something techno-fascism? Is Nick Land techno-fascism?
Nick Land is just a capital-worshipping antihumanist. He's an evil version of extropians.
The thing with the reality of technology is that its the reverse of cyberpunk. Rather than corporations becoming super powerful and controlling everything, I think the internet has actually equalized power somewhat. Now some 14 year old autist can actually compete and some cases even get the better of corporations and states with hacking, and you have new media and companies actually destroying the old monolithic ones that had it comfortable.
Your first post was on to something this is just stupid
Is Neuromancer an AnCap dream come true?
Techno fascism implies humans over tech: Nick Land sides with the Capital on the Bourgeois vs proles dilemma. Machine over man and man either being subdued or assimilated into something inhuman. People on Sillicon Valley likr Breitbart's Mercer are more along the lines of techno fascism.
This
Silicon Valley is the real power at work here don't get rused by /pol/ shit
Not from pol and don't know what shit you're referring to, but this techno utopian future isn't going to happen if there continues to be diversity quotas and anti-white male policies being set in the tech sector. White men are the only people capable of producing advanced technology and are the only ones who ever have, and Silicon Valley is run largely by jews who see white males as a threat and are therefore trying to replace them with women and muds. If you're white you're going to have to throw your hat in the ring at some point if you want to discuss the possibility of these matters. If you just want to beat off to Landian fantasies though, ignore this post.
>White men are the only people capable of producing advanced technology
Wait, what? On what basis are you offering this claim? Surely even the most racist of racists would acknowledge that Japanese, Arabs, and Indians have made significant contributions to science? Have you studied the history of science at all? The very word algorithm comes from the name of an Arab guy.
I suspect you're going to pull out the IQ-by-race jpg but even if white people had a higher IQ on average does that really mean that *all* advanced technology is created by *only* white people? And only white men, at that?
>Silicon Valley is run largely by jews who see white males as a threat
Huh? I thought you said only white males were capable of creating technology? Are white males the heroes or the victims? Which is it?
Did I just fall for the ruse cruise? BTW I'm a white male who is not Jewish. I think SJWs are obnoxious too but you're making no fucking sense and your lack of sense is muddling whatever point you could possibly have.
>I suspect you're going to pull out the IQ-by-race jpg
No, I'm going to pull out the 'whites are responsible for 97% of all scientific innovation' jpg.
>Huh?
Jews control many of the financial distribution arms in Silicon Valley; they are not innovators.
>you're making no fucking sense
And I'll continue to not make sense *to you* if you continue to be uninformed on the topic here.
>I'm a white male
Then start acting like it.
Only intelligent post in this thread
...
>Sterling reached the high point of bitterness around 2006, after his Veridian movement failed completely.
en.wikipedia.org
2009. pretty cyberpunk in places.
it may not be relevant, but it has a strong appeal to disaffected twentysomething males. just go to Djakarta, drop some littler on the ground and see how far you get.
Is this, dare I say it, /ourfuture/?
What does Veeky Forums think of biopunk?
Any recs?
i've only ever read one biopunk story, and i can't remember who wrote it. unless you consider Greg Bear's "Blood Music" as biopunk.
>Does the fact that you know something is happening, stop it from happening.
No. Why is lit full of pseuds
Trying to explain Jewishness in terms of a scientific assessment of evolutionary strategies is ridiculous. They know exactly what they are doing and they are doing it for religious reasons not for survival reasons.
I've always liked the idea of Culture as an alternative
Hm, I don't know. Kevin MacDonald's explanation of jewish behavior as a group evolutionary strategy seems pretty flawless, but I wouldn't deny that is influenced by their bizarro culture and religion. Care to elaborate on the religious reasons you're speaking of?
>just gonna be an hedonistic, ultra consumerist nightmare with an emphasis on technology.
Why are people so reluctant to admit this is the state we live in now? Just because it doesn't correspond exactly with the movies doesn't mean we are not living in it. That's actually funny in itself; you can't realize the reality you described until you're fully entrenched in film's depiction of it.
but i do realize it, user, that was my point. We just need that extra push, and then technofetishism will be much more literal than what it is now
Not that i like it, i think it leads to lots of shallow people and media, but this also means i get time to invest myself in reading and music and movies without anyone bothering me so i'm pretty apathetic towards it
Cyberpunk got everything wrong about what the "low culture/life" would be like to a embarrassing degree similarly to how the psychedelia authors thought we would all be doing copious amounts of psilocybin and mescaline instead of addictive/harmful drugs, what actually happened is people now opt to inject the dirtiest tar heroin in the least spiritual and aesthetic method possible.
Well one of the reasons is to make you believe that evil doesn't exist and that all our actions can be reduced to evolutionary forces outside of our control, just like the theory that Kevin MacDonald proposes.
There's plenty of non-fiction predictions turning out to be wrong, humans just aren't capable of it.
But I think that imagination about the future is still useful, even the military thinks up hypthetical scenarios.
Please tell me more. By "our" were you implying you are jewish or talking about people generally? If it's the former, are we entering volcano demon territory?
>Cyberpunk got everything wrong about what the "low culture/life" would be like
because it was a romanticized version.
>only post which affirms my beliefs in the thread
gb2/pol/
Are you trying to make the "go back to /pol/" crowd look even stupider than they usually do by telling someone who literally said "not from pol" to go back to /pol/?
I'm not Jewish and I don't know everything about The Jews but I do know certain things from first hand experience. Its hard for me to really explain more, one day I will user.
Insectoids are only capable of reverse-engineering to copy/steal existing technology. Indians are the closest to being innovators and inventors but not in such large numbers as you may think, seeing as they churn out "academics" (engineers) in degree mills. Don't act like Islam hasn't completely stifled the ability for creative thought in the Arab world. Any thought that isn't "the will of Allah" is basically shunned.
people from Iran are pretty sensible desu
The extent to which they are has to do with them not being arab semites, or comparatively less so than others in the region. Ancient Aryan people settled in Iran, which is why the word "eh-ran" literally means "ay-ran" ... or Aryan. Same thing happened in India. The upper classes are semi-functional non street shitters because they have high Indo-European admixture from ~4000 years ago.
I literally can't believe that people believe this shit
Are you joking? The above is a many times over proven, scientific fact.
>No, I'm going to pull out the 'whites are responsible for 97% of all scientific innovation' jpg.
Wrong, Jews are responsible for 30% of modern scientific innovation. They just happened to be from those countries. And those statistics are skewed by bias. Ending the timeline to 1950 is obviously a yuropoor tactic to step out of America's shadow.
Keep moving goalposts bitch boy.
You're stupid. Please go back to pol or wherever shithole you crawled from.
Keep dreaming, buddy. Jews may have high verbal IQs but they have very low spatial IQs because they are semites. Spatial tests determine the ability to think abstractly and is a proxy for measuring creativity. Jews are not creative or innovative, nor have they ever been. And you are a liar.
Why does the truth bother you?
>What we are heading for is Mad Max
cunt what
>Ending the timeline to 1950 is obviously a yuropoor tactic to step out of America's shadow.
The book's written by Charles Murray, an American.
You are so stupid like a little child lol.
cyberpunks in this thread: i propose we move to another thread and let the /pol/lacks keep arguing, since they won't go back to their fucking ghetto.
Feels like a cyberpunk dystopia to me. I live in a city in an apartment with other poor people like me. I sleep on the floor in a blanket in the corner of the room I'm sharing. I wake up each morning and ride the government owned transportation and then work most of the day for a mega corporation, making minimum wage. Just a few customers and they've made more money than ill earn all day. My only meal every day is the one provided by said company. We can't break the rules because we're being constantly surveilled by cameras. I'm posting this from a highly advanced computer that fits in my pocket. At my fingertips is unfathomable amounts of data and knowledge.
At times I seemed dense by the constant names, animals and terms invented to lend credibility to history, but the author managed to create a world totally possible in relation to the confrontation of cultures and their beliefs, revolucinarios groups and mamut unions. Definitely worth reading
That's because Cyberpunk is fiction you twat, and the elements that are not pants-on-head retarded are inevitable by the very nature of human psychology and the way our market works.
There's a reason Accelerationists use the verbage that they do. Progress towards the asymptotic endpoint of human advancement is exponential; by the time we can identify the acceleration of concept X we've moved beyond the point of reversing it.
For example, people today are becoming aware of the dangers of unlimited information access and its effects on privacy. So fucking what, are you gonna rip all the cameras out? Of course not, its gone beyond that and we have just as many if not more reasons to keep building more cameras.
Same with people becoming concerned with the military developing remote killing machines. Guess what you neo-luddites, we're gonna keep dropping bombs and shooting guns that don't need humans.
This is contrary to shit in Cyberpunk which is typically not truly acceleratory. You get wackjob shit like street ninjas with katanas and computer systems designed to control when everyone fucks - and none of these things have any impetus to be developed or continually advanced in spite of the dangers or misgivings in the real world. This is also why true speculative fiction and cyberpunk almost never cross paths.
>Kevin MacDonald's explanation of jewish behavior as a group evolutionary strategy seems pretty flawless
Except for the fact that Jews as an ethnic and cultural group have not EXISTED for long enough to have such distinct traits hardwired into their brains by process of natural and artificial selection.
Jewishness (and behavior patterns across ethnic, religious, and even species lines) is not evolutionary, its a set of cultural values with varying levels of presence in different groups and individuals, which is influenced strongly by the subculture in which the individual develops as well as their religious, psychological, academic, and etc background.
>I'm posting this from a highly advanced computer that fits in my pocket. At my fingertips is unfathomable amounts of data and knowledge.
Your crypto-fascist technocratic overlords aren't doing a very good job then, huh? Its almost like nothing but the life choices of you and perhaps the people immediately around you are keeping you chained, instead of some conspiratorial Big Brother.
the future is either Mad Max of techno-fascist dystopia
it is the Age of Strife or the Imperium of Man
good writers are timeless. i like gibson, i think he's stylish when he's not trying too hard, but i was reading neuromancer when the protag said:
>hey, i got 3 MB of some hot RAM
three whole megabytes? jesus, watch out! interpol is going to be on your ass like stink on cheese!
It's a process, give it time and I'll bet the internet becomes censored. When I lived in South Korea, just to play Counter Strike with a friend, I needed to use his mom's SSN to create an account. I think that's the direction the world is headed in eventually, net neutrality won't last because it doesn't benefit anyone with power. Leaks are dangerous.
>three whole megabytes? jesus, watch out! interpol is going to be on your ass like stink on cheese!
you do appreciate that he was writing that before the internet existed? on a manual typewriter?
i get the idea he couldn't wait to escape from the SF ghetto. pattern recognition was about pants.
>Except for the fact that Jews as an ethnic and cultural group have not EXISTED for long enough to have such distinct traits hardwired into their brains by process of natural and artificial selection.
This isn't true. Jews have been a genetically cohesive group for thousands of years if not longer. There has been more than enough time for them to have certain traits hardwired into their brains and they obviously do. Not to mention jews are the most inbred people on the planet, which makes these traits even more prevalent. To say their behavior is not evolutionary is simply bizarre.
>genetically cohesive group for thousands of years if not longer.
>if pol told me so it must be true
en.wikipedia.org
>Not to mention jews are the most inbred people on the planet
It's the absolute opposite, there's no ethnic group that has mixed as much as them
>It's a process
>all the things I said that are the case aren't
>but they will happen in the future for reason
>which somehow means I'm right in meaning that we live in a dystopia now because it might happen in the future
How is Warhammer 40k not a techno-fascist dream?
>Jews have been a genetically cohesive group for thousands of years if not longer.
Every group is genetically cohesive, by definition. It's all about how you chose the metric of 'cohesiveness', not how you chose the group.
While jews have picked up DNA from various places since they are parasites constantly seeking a host, they are still genetically similar to each other and we know this because they have the most studied genome of any group. They have all kinds of genetic diseases due to being so inbred, i.e., similar, i.e., referred to as "the tribe."
They are spread out and many have mixed with their hosts, but the vast majority are still genetically similar due to high levels of inbreeding in the past.
If I was making an honest attempt to stay out of the clutches of techno-fascism just about the last thing I would be doing is posting on Veeky Forums training the feds author recognition systems giving them insight into my political leanings and a trove of blackmail material.
Generally I'd say techno-fascism is inevitable and is only staved off at this point by the expansion of free flow of information outpacing any efforts to control it.
>the feds author recognition systems
Huh?
>i never read anything cyberpunk
tardo
People tend to use certain patterns in their writing, there is software that picks up on those patterns and gives a reasonable estimate of who you are. The accuracy varies depending on how somebody writes but generally is low. The software can be largely foiled by countermeasures such as say, not giving large samples of text for such a program to work with.
Lets say you're the NSA, and maybe a hundred people could have leaked some information. You see a piece of writing from the leaker. You notice it contains a lot of semicolons. You figure out who uses a bunch of semicolons. Ipso presto you have a prime suspect.
I; THE SEMICOLON BANDIT; STRIKES AGAIN; THE FEDS CAN'T STOP THIS MADMAN!