Southern gothic discussion thread

How so

Look at Twilight and 50 Shades formula. A Chad who could have any woman he wants falls in live with a meh woman and makes her happy.

Well how is that a southern gothic

The question I was answering was what genre was worth writing in. If by worth financial worth was meant, then the main criteria is, will it apppeal to mediocre women. Sperging out on a well researched history of the forging of Confederate cavalry sabers, or economic analysis of the boll weevils effect on southern agriculture might get you more scholarly praise but wealthy plantation owners ripping bodices will probly sell better

Oh ok, I misunderstood. I am not interested in money as I am well being I just want to write, but my question is if southern gothic is worth writing in artistic sense in pomo era since all great SG writers are gone and genre is kinda dying, only recent thing is True detective

I guess the question is, do you have anything to add to the genre or do just plan on recycling the old cliches.

If you can achieve something that is remotely as inspired as Night of the Hunter, you could toss the script from the window of your car and someone would find it and produce it.

>How to properly use grotesque and magic realism?
I dunno, maybe watch movies or TV shows that have actually done this, and go and do likewise with your own hopefully fresh and original spin. Eg, True Blood, Angel Heart, Deliverance, Cape Fear, The Beguiled, Winter's Bone, etc.

Is it ok to lay out idea here so you can tell me what you think

Yeah, why not? There's no rule against it. I do note that ideas are as free as the air -- anyone can take them. Proceed accordingly, at your own risk.

Basically, story follows two generations of community in a fictional county; one in 1920s (birth and developing of a county) and one in 1980s (death of a county) in Mississippi, both dealing with unsolved, unrelated crimes. Major themes would be gnosticim and eternal reccurance (as edgy that may sound). There is a lot more detail but I am too paranoid to post it

Feedback?

I'd recommend you read A Streetcar Named Desire for help on the grotesque and magic realism. The film version was good, but didn't capture the southern gothic & expressionism of the theatre play.

That's not immediately compelling, but it could work, it's hard to say.

Often stories like that are told by giving the set-up (1920s) in a relatively short prologue, which whets the viewers appetite, followed by the main body of the story.

Eg, Black Sunday youtube.com/watch?v=oGRUVH13CM8

Or Horror Hotel youtube.com/watch?v=xOZB1g8qEl4

But a more even division timewise (say, 1 hour for 1920s, 1 hours for 1980s), that's a little more unusual; I can't think of any examples of that offhand, but I'm sure there are some.

Yet another alternative is the Skeleton Key approach, where we jump into the story in the present time, and then the spooky background is doled out only gradually as the protagonist is compelled by events to become an amateur detective. Skeleton Key was a darn good horror movie; maybe that approach would work for you. An investigation of an intriguing mystery is a classic way to grab and hold a viewer's interest. Just a thought.

It's all a question of what you can make work.

And not just the impedimenta of gnosticism and spookiness, but with CHARACTERS who engage our interest. Think True Detective. I love the spooky angle, but the thing that really kept me engaged were the two characters - both beautifully written and played - whether individually or together, where the chemistry between them was such a joy.

It's a question of being a good dramatist. It's one thing to have an idea for something like True Detective. It's another thing to actually be able to write scenes like the several scenes in which Rust is interviewed by the police, and make those scenes work dramatically (and they work beautifully, they're dramatic and funny and compelling), and then be able to write the quite different Woody Harrelson scenes and make *them* work.

A writer who can be a dramatist who can create interesting characters and then make all those different kinds of scenes work, and then on top of that sprinkle in compelling spooky details -- well, you know, not everyone can do that. It takes talent. And the only way to figure out if you have talent, and if you do how much, is to dive in and actually try to write something.

That said, if you think about it, in some respects the least of the screenwriter's worries in TD was the spooky stuff. The main labor, the hard part, was developing the characters and writing all those great scenes, including the ones with no spooky stuff whatsoever.

>There is a lot more detail but I am too paranoid to post it
Nothing wrong with that; that's probably a sound instinct.

Really appreciate detailed response. Did you read/watch No Country for Old Men and if yes what did you think about characters. I found my work to be influenced a lot by McCarthy, especially force of evil which drives the plot such as Judge Holden from Blood Meridian or Chigur from Ncfom

Thanks, will do that

I read and watched NCOM. Chigur is an amazing villain, the other characters are just good enough for the story to work. In particular, the way the husband and wife are brought to life by their little dialogue exchanges was very fresh and nice. And, e.g., the guy's decision to bring the shot guy agua. But those characters, excluding Chigur and to a lesser extent the sheriff, were not nearly as complex or interesting as the main TD characters.

That said, not every screenplay *needs* great characters like TD. The further thought I had after posting was how almost *all* the characters in Skeleton Key are quite generic. Especially the main character. I mean, she's nothing more or less than a pretty girl in her 20s who gets a new job. There's almost nothing distinctive or interesting about her character. BUT it WORKS, because the mechanics of the story work. We identify with her, and that's enough. We sympathize with her impulse to help the poor old man, and watch with increasing dread as the forces of evil turn and take a bead on *her* and she's forced to scramble to defend herself.

So not every story has to be as inspired character-wise as TD -- although it certainly doesn't hurt to be able to write the kind of dialogue that snaps characters and relationships to life with the concision and wit and punch of NOCM. I'm thinking of the little exchanges in the trailer and on the phone. Great stuff.

- Where'd you get the pistol?
- At the gettin' place.

But I'm no expert on McCarthy. Been meaning to read BM, all the talk about it in this place.

Thanks man, great insight. What did you think about how TD ending was written?

The ending in terms of catching the villain was a bit meh. There was nothing there that really made me sit up. There were a couple of nice beats, but given all the build-up, it was a bit of a disappointment, tbqh.

The ending in terms of the characters was very nice and satisfying... maybe almost too nice... but it was satisfying.

publishersweekly.com/pw/by-topic/industry-news/tip-sheet/article/66013-10-best-southern-gothic-books.html

Not that user but I enjoyed reading your analysis. Also, the dual timeframe setting was executed wonderfully in Memento. And of course the godfather movies.