/Essentials/ Supplements edition

This is pretty much the gold standard, creatine is the only thing to be proven in numerous studies to help gain lean mass among other things since it's THE MOST researched supplement out there. Others like BCAA are bogus, a lot people get bcaas from meat, dairy including whey protein and eggs, there's no need to supplement. As for ZMA, Zinc etc it's also b.s. The only massive test spike i've seen was from a Holy Basil study, it contains a large concentration of Ursolic acid, which looks very steroid like in it's molecular composition and has also shown anabolic effects in rats. Not many studies have been done though, one study implicated negative effects on spermatogenisis which led to the test boost conclusion.

So is pre workout a placebo or just useless? It's the only supplement other than whey I've ever considered

and none of those are """supplements""".

must suck to be retarded.

>Creatine side effects:
>Bipolar disorder: There have been cases of manic episodes in people with bipolar disorder who took creatine daily for 4 weeks. Creatine might make mania worse in people with bipolar disorder.

Definitely not a good supplement for most Veeky Forumsizens.

Magnesium. Especially if you drink alcohol to excess and take stimulants. So basically every college aged male.

they can be supplemented. playing on semantics doesn't make you smart, retard.

I wouldn't say Useless just overkill, it's main ingredients are going to be
am Ephedrine replacement, in most cases it's synephrine or derivative thereof, this is to curb the ban on ephedrine/amphetamine/phenethylamine products and precursors thanks to the FDA
Creatine
Caffeine
other bullshit extracts mostly from black pepper, piperine, piperonal or deer antlers or platapus penis, strange plants from india etc
All you need before a workout is caffeine, that's it, if you want to go deep then chug a redbull which is just caffeine, sugar and b vitamins, basically a nice cold pre workout.

There's an interview with Frank Zane, I think by Artemus Dolgin where he talks about preworkouts in the 70's and 80's, most people just drank coffee before an intense workout.
Black beauty diet pills were common around then and they where amphetamine caps, mostly marketed towards women.

Thanks a lot man, I plan to start lifting and even though I'm a big guy I have a weak upper body. So thanks again for the info

Lift weights, put them down again, eat food/protein, sleep. repeat. Get them gains.